yeah, when religion is discussed, it is the left
Posted By: always bashing. -a "prayer" is not fanatic. on 2008-09-10
In Reply to: See message. - Just being honest!
nm
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- See message. - Just being honest!
- yeah, when religion is discussed, it is the left - always bashing. -a "prayer" is not fanatic.
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forgetting your religion? yeah, right
yeah and what religion is that anyway. I read the bible
and when I hear people like Palin addressing someone in the audience 'god bless you sir' and then without even taking a breath turning and stirring up hate and fear, boasting her son is over in Iraq fighting for freedom of speech, well it does not add up. No thanks,
I never really cared for Hillary but at least she did not come off as some kind of a kook
"angry right". Yeah, lol. The left is so angry and
nm
Yeah. Those hateful liberals are being sued right and left
x
Yeah now all the dummies are left... why do you post NM as your name, coward?
nm
Yeah, the left picks on Rush, but at least he makes
nm
Yeah, real weird. The left would say she was crappy if if she was funny...
Not surprising.
By the way, maybe she wasn't funny because SNL gave her a crappy script.
Ever think of it that way? They hate her too, ya know....
Yeah, and little motivation left to work hard or earn
nm
yeah, & I've got a left nostril inhaler to sell ya, too.
Some people will believe any load of crap the guy spews. How many "bad actors" does this guy need to have in his past before you finally figure out he's totally smitten with the 60s radical crap? Laugh if you want, but if he wins, the proof will be here in the archives. It's not like you all weren't warned time and time again.
Ohhh, yeah! I still have plenty duct tape and candles left over, so I should be aiight :):) nm
Why is this being discussed?
This happened a long time ago. Is the point to make one party look bad and the other good? That is silly. Both parties at some point or another have made horrible decisions. Maybe I'm PMSing and emotional, but I'm a little offended by this thread. I certainly was not alive to vote those people into Congress, therefore why should I be 'punished' for something they did before I was even born. The whole thing is just very inflammatory. Why don't we discuss things that are in the present that we have some say over? Observer, I usually defend you at least a little, but you took this discussion to a hurtful place. That is an ugly time in our history and to make it sound like Democrats are responsible for it, or at least were the only ones who wanted it to continue, is very offensive. I know everyone will probably say that Bush bashing is hurtful, and maybe it is, but that is something that is happening currently that we have a right to discuss. We have the ability to vote in regards to these issues that are happening NOW.
As this has already been discussed
I will not revisit any of the existing arguments from the other thread. I just want to point out that Obama will not be king able to make a decree on whim. A program like this, if it truly is like some are interpreting it, would have to be passed by Congress and would probably take years to implement if it did, which is doubtful. Besides, I sincerely doubt that the Dems will hold the majority at the midterm elections. I would suggest that any who are concerned about this take gourdpainter's advice posted above.
This was discussed below.
I think it is just plain sad really. If you are white, you don't qualify for a job. If you are highly skilled, you don't qualify. Why wouldn't you want highly skilled people? That is just plain retarded right there. Things are bad enough right now that all people, including all races, are losing jobs and highly skilled people are losing jobs. Why should they be not included in this opportunity? Sounds to me like they would prefer to have unskilled minorities build stuff than highly skilled individuals. To me that suggests p*ss poor work being done and very poor management...but whatever.
Then again....we've always sort of had this problem. Companies have a certain quota of minorities they have to hire and often pick a minority with less skill and qualifications over someone who is skilled just to meet their quota of hiring minorities. So what is the point of being skilled? Once again....the dumbing down of America right there.
This is the experience currently being discussed.
Before answering the question, please read the following. This is posted in response to pub spin that would assert SP is better qualified to lead the country because of O's lack of experience. Of special note are the numerous foreign relations committee diplomatic initiatives listed below. Of course, I would be interested in any comparabl experience SP may have that the pubs can produce. I have saved this post and will be using it in reply to any similar assertions made by pubs in the future whenever I encounter them. Hope format is not too seedy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_Senate_career_of_Barack_Obama
In Illinois senate O Worked to get BIPARTISAN support on legislation on:
1. Ethics reform.
2. Health care reform.
3. Sponsored bills for earned income tax credits for low-income workers.
4. Provisions for $100 million in tax cuts to families.
5. Provisions for early childhood education.
6. Welfare reform.
7. Childcare subsidies.
8. Funding for churches and community groups.
9. Chairman of the Health and Human Services Committee.
10. Instituted requirement for transparent videotaped police interrogations of suspects in capitol cases after a number of death row inmates were found innocent.
11. Measures against racial profiling.
12. Campaign finance reform.
13. Restrictions on lobbyists activities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_career_of_Barack_Obama
In US Senate:
1. Senate Committee (SC) on Foreign Relations.
2. SC on Health.
3. SC on Health.
4. SC on Labor and Pensions.
5. SC on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs.
6. SC on Veterans' Affairs.
7. Member of Congressional Black Caucus.
8. Chairman of the Subcommitte on European Affairs.
9. Border security and Immigration reform. Cosponsor "Secure America and Orderly Immigration Act introduced by JM.
10. Added 3 amendments to the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act.
11. Supported Secure Fence Act for security improvements along US-Mexico border.
12. Cosponsored Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act of 2006.
13. Introduced expansions to Cooperative Threat Reduction Program to secure and dismantle weapons of mass destruction and their associated infrastructure in former Soviet Union states.
14. Sponsor of Democratic Republic of Congo Relief, Security and Democracy Promotion Act, signed by Bush, to restore basic services like clinics and schools, train a professional, integrated and accountable police force and military, and otherwise support the Congolese in protecting their human rights and rebuilding their nation.
15. As member of Foreign Relations Committee, he made official trips to Eastern Europe, the Middle East and Africa. His 2005 trip to Russia, Ukraine and Azerbaijan focus on strategy planning for the control of world's supply of conventional weapons, biological weapons and WMDs and defense against potential terrorist attacks.
16. January 2006, met with US military in Kuwait and Iraq. Visited Jordan, Israel and Palestinian territories. Asserted preconditions that US will never recognize legitimacy of Hamas leadership until they renounce elimination of Israel.
17. August 2006, official trip to South Africa, Kenya, Djibouti, Ethiopia and Chad where he made televised appearance addressing ethnic rivalries and corruption in Kenya.
18. Worked on Honest Leadership and Open Government Act, signed into law, to eliminate gifts of travel on corporate jets by lobbyists to members of Congress and require disclosure of bundled campaign contributions.
19. Cosponsored bill to criminalize deceptive practices in federal elections to include fraudulent flyers and automated phone calls.
20. Cosponsored climate change bill to reduce greenhouse gas emissions by two-thirds by 2050.
21. Promoted liquefied coal production of gas and diesel.
22. Introduced Iraq War De-Escalation Act of 2007 to cap troop levels as prelude to phased troop withdrawal and removal of all combat brigades.
23. Cosponsored amendment to Defense Authorization Act safeguarding personality disorder military discharges.
24. Sponsored Iran Sanctions Enabling Act in support of divestment of state pensions funds from Iran's oil and gas industry.
25. Introduced legislation to reduce risks of nuclear terrorism., provisions of which were added as amendments to the State-Foreign Operations appropriations bill.
26. Sponsored a Senate amendment to the State Children's Health Insurance program providing one-year job protection for family members caring for soldiers with combat-related injuries, which passed both houses of Congress with bipartisan support but was ultimately vetoed by fearless George.
It is so ridiculous that this is still being discussed.
nm
We discussed the same issue...
he is just another man elected to be president who just happens to be half black. Big deal. Also, for the state of the economy, there is certainly a lot of money being spent for this charade. A low key celebration would be fine, not the 150 million dollar price tag we are footing some of the bill for. He will never live up to the hype he has generated. The bloom will be off the rose before long and we will have a front row seat for the further decline of our economy, not to mention the terrorists who are anxiously awaiting an Obama administration.
LOL. *Liberal Religion* = ANY religion that isn't YOURS.
You don't want EQUALITY in religion. You want yours to be SUPERIOR to all others. You want to force your narrow and specific religious beliefs down the throats of every single American. You can't get them into your religion willingly so you'll FORCE them to fall in step with you via government if you have to.
You couldn't stop abortion by killing abortion doctors, so now you'll do it through the Supreme Court. And your God on earth just happens to be a president who wants the same things that you do, and so he's willing to throw the Constitution out the window (in violation of his Presidential oath) in order to replace it, not just with the Christian Bible, but with his own personal clone who will legislate her own narrow evangelical Christian views that don't even agree with the less radical, quieter forms of the Christian religion.
Government, schools and universities don't fall into the same categories.
There already ARE religous schools and universities. Isn't THAT enough for you?
And what about all those many, MANY buildings with crosses and other religious symbols on them throughout this nation where people of like-minded beliefs congregate to worship the God of their CHOICE? I believe they're called CHURCHES. Isn't THAT enough for you, either?
Nope. You're not going to be happy until you can be *superior.*
The sad fact is that in a country with freedom of religion, you never WILL BE, whether you like it or not. You can put 9 THOUSAND justices on the Supreme Court, you still won't be SUPERIOR, and I believe God, who is all knowing, knows that as well!
Because the Muslim religion is the only religion that says.....
Convert or die.
Already been discussed on both boards. Catch up. nm
x
No - martial law discussed 9/18/09 - under Bush...
Sept.18: Congressional Leaders told US Economy Had Been Hours Away from Collapse
February 10, 2009, 4:32AM
A stunning video has surfaced of Rep. Paul Kanjorski (D-PA) describing Thursday September 18 when Bernanke and Paulson starkly informed Congressional leaders how close the economy had come to collapsing that day.
After $550 billion had been electronically drawn out of money market accounts and $105 billion had been poured back into the system with no effect, the Federal Reserve and the Treasury made the decision to shut down the money market accounts and announce a guarantee of $250,000 per account. Rep. Kanjorski:
If they had not done that their estimation was that by two o'clock that afternoon, $5.5 trillion would have been drawn out of the money market system of the United States, would have collapsed the entire economy of the United States, and within 24 hours the world economy would have collapsed.
It would have been the end of our economic system and our political system as we know it. [via Magnifico at Daily Kos]
Again via Magnifico, The Motley Fool adds some background as well as a possible connection to martial law in The One Jaw Dropping Video that Every Fool Must See. Both Sen. Inhofe, R-Okla., and Rep. Brad Sherman, D-Calif claim that Paulson brought up the possibility of a declaration of martial law.
The same article also revealed that a November 2008 Army War College Report discusses the possible use of the US military in the event of a domestic economic collapse.
Widespread civil violence inside the United States would force the defense establishment to reorient priorities in extremis to defend basic domestic order and human security. Deliberate employment of weapons of mass destruction or other catastrophic capabilities, unforeseen economic collapse... are all paths to disruptive domestic shock. [p.32] Support for Kanjorski's claims can be found in archives from that time period:
Congressional Leaders Stunned by Warnings, NY Times, Sept. 19, 2008.
...as the Fed chairman, Ben S. Bernanke, laid out the potentially devastating ramifications of the financial crisis before congressional leaders on Thursday night, there was a stunned silence at first. Mr. Bernanke and Treasury Secretary Henry M. Paulson Jr. had made an urgent and unusual evening visit to Capitol Hill...
Rushing to save money-market funds, CNN Money, Sept. 19, 2008
By Friday, federal officials worried that the strain on money-market funds had become too great and threatened the world's financial system.
As an aside, if all of this happened on Thursday, Sept. 18, why in the world did McCain wait until the last minute on the 24th to cancel his interview with David Letterman?
No - martial law discussed 9/18/08 - under Bush...
Sept.18: Congressional Leaders told US Economy Had Been Hours Away from Collapse
February 10, 2009, 4:32AM
A stunning video has surfaced of Rep. Paul Kanjorski (D-PA) describing Thursday September 18 when Bernanke and Paulson starkly informed Congressional leaders how close the economy had come to collapsing that day.
After $550 billion had been electronically drawn out of money market accounts and $105 billion had been poured back into the system with no effect, the Federal Reserve and the Treasury made the decision to shut down the money market accounts and announce a guarantee of $250,000 per account. Rep. Kanjorski:
If they had not done that their estimation was that by two o'clock that afternoon, $5.5 trillion would have been drawn out of the money market system of the United States, would have collapsed the entire economy of the United States, and within 24 hours the world economy would have collapsed.
It would have been the end of our economic system and our political system as we know it. [via Magnifico at Daily Kos]
Again via Magnifico, The Motley Fool adds some background as well as a possible connection to martial law in The One Jaw Dropping Video that Every Fool Must See. Both Sen. Inhofe, R-Okla., and Rep. Brad Sherman, D-Calif claim that Paulson brought up the possibility of a declaration of martial law.
The same article also revealed that a November 2008 Army War College Report discusses the possible use of the US military in the event of a domestic economic collapse.
Widespread civil violence inside the United States would force the defense establishment to reorient priorities in extremis to defend basic domestic order and human security. Deliberate employment of weapons of mass destruction or other catastrophic capabilities, unforeseen economic collapse... are all paths to disruptive domestic shock. [p.32] Support for Kanjorski's claims can be found in archives from that time period:
Congressional Leaders Stunned by Warnings, NY Times, Sept. 19, 2008.
...as the Fed chairman, Ben S. Bernanke, laid out the potentially devastating ramifications of the financial crisis before congressional leaders on Thursday night, there was a stunned silence at first. Mr. Bernanke and Treasury Secretary Henry M. Paulson Jr. had made an urgent and unusual evening visit to Capitol Hill...
Rushing to save money-market funds, CNN Money, Sept. 19, 2008
By Friday, federal officials worried that the strain on money-market funds had become too great and threatened the world's financial system.
As an aside, if all of this happened on Thursday, Sept. 18, why in the world did McCain wait until the last minute on the 24th to cancel his interview with David Letterman?
Yes, but it was not going to be discussed and your pictures posted on the internet...
for the entire country to see and discuss. Her privacy, which she is entitled to as a 16-year-old, has been invaded in a very nasty way. Sorry, that is the way I feel about it. I think it was terribly wrong for dailykrap to post it and terribly wrong for someone to spread it even further here. But that is just me.
as part of a phased withdrawal, discussed with and
There is a specified end sight as posted on O's website for those who are interested in fact over fiction. http://www.barackobama.com/issues/iraq/#phased-withdrawal
Excuse me. Clearly, the women, children, babies and elders in that video posed no immediate threat to US troops there. No need for pudit expert analysis on that one.
Obama actually does differ on McCain in his Afghanistan plan, especially when it comes to more precise targeting (like OBL, to name one instance) and measures that would protect and spare civilian populations from blanket bombing of entire villages to "flush out" a half dozen "known" Taliban.
Diplomacy has not been tried with Taliban or any other theocratic leadership in view of the "we don't negotiate with terrorist" W dogma...that is, of course, until recently when he decided to flip to the O side of diplomatic policy and explore the idea of establishing an American "Interests" Section in Tehran.
You cannot possibly pretend to know what sort of progress can be made under leadership guided by a president who has the kind of insight O has into Islamic cultures until those initiatives are explored. What is apparent from that video is that ANY and ALL efforts should be undertaken to succeed in disarming terrorist arsenals AND appeal and that measures should be undertaken to prevent the slaughter of women, children, babies and old men.
O has very clearly articulated his approach and policies on diplomacy on his website, which have been available since the day he launched his campaign. Show me the McCain plan for diplomacy. Don't just claim he "knows what he is doing" because he knows his way around a battlefield. Show me the plan. I will not address the rest of the post because it reflects all that tired out politics of fear warmongering rhetoric that 80% of the nation has clearly indicated it no longer buys into.
This was all discussed ad nauseum in this morning's thread.
he said it before the election? I am not going to spend my time repeating verbatim the information that is sitting immediately under this thread. No one, including the MILLIONS of your fellow citizens who support the closing of Gitmo, thought it was going to be easy, but it IS going to be done, not by finding another way, but by doing it the way Obama has already put into action.
BTW, sodiers have been speaking up against the govt for quite some time now...in fact, for years before Obama ever took office. Ever heard of the Winter Soldiers?
Enter the elephant in the room not beind discussed
Under the Obama administration, reform in trade agreements, incentives to keep jobs stateside and targets plans to make it easier to unionize will be changing that picture. Pubs have lost this grip, no matter how loud they protest, how many GOP alert memos they send or how hard they pretend otherwise. Look for the unions to make a long overdue comeback. Then we shall see just how outdated they are.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You've said before that you're leaving, but you and your goons can't sta
you mean left wing....it's a left wing ding website on the messiah....the right wouldn't bothe
yeah, yeah, yeah.....what he failed to mention...
is that the Dems are responsible for the mortgage meltdown which is responsible for the wall street meltdown. Chris Dodd, Barney Frank...totally to blame. Blocked every attemmpt by Bush Admin and yes, McCain, to regulate fannie/freddie. Dems certainly have selective memories...convenient bouts of amnesia. lol.
Religion
Religion - ?riduculous?
I will tell you what is more riduculous - those who truly believe that there IS NO GOD (wonder how in the he## you got here in the first place)...scary..
In regards to religion
It was Barrack Obama who quoted scripture during his speech at that dinner they had last week. I'm so sick and tired of hearing people whine and complain because Sarah Palin is a believer. Well....according to Barrack Obama....so is he! Palin prayed for our country and people freaked out. Obama's church preaches about him from the pulpit gaining control in a dominant white world and how they are oppressed by whitey, etc.....that should be more concerning than whether or not Sarah Palin prayed for our country especially since Obama attended that church full of hate for 20 YEARS!!! Sheesh.
religion
I believe that O sees himself as a Christian with a Muslim father and biracial.
being gay is not a religion
Your talking about two different topics.
My religion is not
Since my sole aim as a Christian is to have a relationship with Christ, I have no religion. I brought up same-sex marriage because of the posts alleging that homosexuals are missing out on some perceived "right." Marriage is not a right in the first place. It is a privilege, like having a drivers license. Blind people shouldn't drive and couples who can't copulate in the way God intended should not be married. Your husband is as messed up as you are. ;-)
It may apply to your religion, but
it doesn't apply to the Constitution.
Are you suggesting that your religion should be the one that rules and that everyone else's spiritual/religious beliefs shouldn't count?
For example, I know some people who don't look at abortion as severely as you do because they believe that life doesn't end, that we merely pass on from one life to another, and that there really isn't any such thing as spiritual death, and that your body is just the "box" you come in but spirit lives on forever and continues to live in different "entities."
I know some people who don't believe in religion at all.
I know some religious people who believe that God gave us free will and technology to help us survive as best we can.
Not everyone is FORCED to believe the exact same religious beliefs that you do. But the one document we all have in common and to which are are all bound is the Constitution.
I respect you enough as a person to respect and defend your personal religious beliefs.
Please return the favor.
I have nothing against the Muslim religion anyway
I would bet that there are millions of Muslims throughout the world who are exceptionally good, hardworking people. It seems to me that each religion has people who will try to twist it around as an excuse to do just about anything. Look at those Baptists down south who protest gays at dead soldiers funerals because they say God is killing all these soldiers because American is getting too accepting of gay people. These Baptists are obviously horrible people, but does that mean all Baptists distort their religion to spew hate and prey on grieving families? Of course not.
I could care less what religion Obama is or was at one time. I think he is an excellent candidate. He is one of the few people who could turn this country (and maybe even this world) around. We need someone strong enough and smart enough to lead this country and help to unite us again, and I think he's the man for the job. I also agree with what someone else said in regard to his knowledge of the Muslim religion/culture being a good thing, especially considering our current dire situation.
Forget his religion,
he was a total bomb as a governor. He said one thing to get elected governor, then changed his mind when he decided to run for president. Then he went around the country bashing Massachusetts. Now there is a story in the newspaper that there were illegal immigrants painting his house even after all the problems with his landscapers. Such a hypocrite.
Sorry....I do not ever "check" my religion...
it is not put on on Sunday (or Saturday, whatever day one chooses to observe) and taken off on Monday. It is part of the fabric of my life. It is a constant. And that is not a bad thing. Have you read the papers of the founding fathers, wise men of great vision? They did not check their "religion" at the door. It is part of parcel of our founding documents and heavily influenced their decisions. People came here from England for the express purpose of religious freedom. THat is what this country is based upon. And from that desire for religious freedom came all our other freedoms. Our base set of laws is based on the Ten Commandments. Basic moral principles. So I beg to disagree. Our founding fathers lived their beliefs. They did not check it when they walked into Independence Hall.
The establishment of a state religion is prohibited by our constitution. Prayer inside the white house is not prohibited. They pray in the senate and in the house. They prayed on the steps of the Capitol on 9-11. Nothing in the constitution prohibits prayer, in fact it says freedom of religion and the free expression thereof and certainly says nothing about keeping it in church.
The freedom of religion clause was for a specific reason...that no government would establish a state religion and compel the entire country to follow it. It expressly provides for the free expression of faith. And it should not be a basis for discrimination.
Yes indeed, wise men of great vision, our forefathers. If you are interested in how they felt and thought, at this site are their quotes.
http://www.eadshome.com/QuotesoftheFounders.htm
Please give an example where she put her religion above the...
needs of our country. She has certainly done fine by the state of Alaska. Higher approval ratings than either O or Joe.
using religion as a blunt
instrument to beat your opponent over the head with is a very cynical misappropriation of the teachings of the great religions. It does more damage to the believers than it does to the nonbelievers.
seems to have more to do with religion than politics nm
nm
I know, I don't think religion should be part of it either (sm)
But if McCain had been attending a white supremist church that hated African-Americans and had a minister who spewed hatred, and he had attended that church for 20 years and called the minister one of his mentors.....who would vote for him?? No black person, no non-caucasian person, and at least 90% of whites would not vote for him either!
They don't care if you got religion or not..they
X
Of course, you better hope you do have religion
they are already in Europe doing just that. The Muslim population has gone out of control as well as their minds since, unfortunately, Europe was trying to be so PC and let them come in. Bet they're regretting that now.
Now, they wanna do the same with country and if you turn your back to it, they'll have those in this country trying to tell us how to think.....wait....what am I saying.....they already do!!!
Holy cow! You could use some religion...
Muslim or otherwise!!
religion and all that talk sm
Gee, the way I handle it is every night I thank the god of my understanding for getting me and my family through the day and I tell him or her how I appreciate all I have and to ask forgiveness if I hurt anyone that day. I think things get a little out of hand with all this discussion of doom and gloom. I don't have the right to tell anyone else what to do or what to believe. The only thing I think my God might say about all this negativity is, "Don't make me have to come down there!" Loosen up and do your best each day. That's what I do for me and my family, why practice doom and gloom when we have a day right in front of us to do our best in. Just my humble opinion. I hate to instill "fear" in anyone. If you don't sin, you won't have to repent.
I don't know much about the Muslim religion (sm)
but I do know that no one is born a Christian. That is not how we see it. You can be born to a Christian family and be taught Christian beliefs but you have to consciously decide to become a Christian, it is not something you are automatically born as.
Have you been brainwashed by religion?
nm
BB, you don't think religion has a place anywhere! LOL sm
You do know I'm just kidding, right?
Warren did take a biblical stand against gay marriage and homosexuality, which does surprise me, considering what "The MESSage" says, but as much as I disagree with him on a lot of things (not necessarily environmental) I have to agree with his stance regarding what you refer to as alternative lifestyles. According to the Bible, homosexuality ranks right in there with all the other things you mentioned. I won't go any further into that because this is not the forum for it. However, I do think that Warren's watered down style probably fits in more with Obama's idea of religion that, oh, say, Billy Graham might. I just wonder if Rev. Wright got his feelings hurt because he wasn't chosen. He was, after all, Obama's religious mentor.
They question if his religion is
I am sure he is not Jehova Witness.
Freedom of religion....(sm)
also includes freedom FROM religion. It's funny to me that, as you said, people came to this country for freedom of religion (among other things). Now that they're here christians try to impose the very problems associated with those in Britian on the people of this nation. Christians are constantly trying to force their will upon others through politics. Please explain to me how that demonstrates freedom of religion. Doesn't that just put us back where we were?
Freedom of religion is a live and let live proposition....not a winner takes all competition.
Maybe so...but what if the chosen religion
Do you want the Koran read in schools? Do you want the Torah used to make government decisions?
Remember when you invite religion into politics, that not all religion is christianity. Be careful what you wish for.
This is why I don't think relgion has any place in politics.
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