What bothers you about the facts?

• The era of socialism - franklyscarlett
  • 445,000 per citizen is the bill for the bail outs. - Fascism
    • "Democrats, too, are insisting that the rescue ....sm - ms
      • It didn't bother them to cause this mess.... - sam
    • Not yet, but it will be if we vote in a socialist president. - sam
      • lol.....and yet, very, very scary at the same time....lol....nm - ms
  • You really need to do your homework - both sides to blame......nm
  • Forced into that positin by your favorite... - sam
  • How's that for a kick in the head? - myrtle
    • There was no surplus. That was debunked years ago. - sam
      • P-L-E-A-S-E post an - TTP
        • When you can't refute, you attack. lol. nm - sam
          • to attack, I would have to - TTP
            • Best description of the Samunist I've read yet. - Right on, right on.
            • Again, you can't refute, so you attack.... - sam
              • Sam & Alinsky - Hip to your jive
                • Yeah!! You GO, "Hip"! It's about time - Sam was outed.
                • I believe I was the first one to mention Alinsky... - sam
                  • Please provide a reference showing that you were the first to mention Alinsky? - Proof Please
                  • I believe you are wrong, Sam! - Hip to your jive
              • This is like listening to a broken record! (nm) - Dizzy Gillespie
                • If you can refute what I posted, refute it.... - sam
                  • Sorry, Sam...this fish is too smart to take your bait! - Back to the Bait Shop
                    • Or not smart enough to have a legitimate - reply..........nm
                • Oops...there is a message - typed (nm) by mistake. - Dizzy Gillespie
        • What bothers you about the facts? - sm
    • How dare you post here and not go through . . . - Sarcastic MT
      • Thanks for the chuckle....;) - myrtle
    • You don't follow the board much, do you? - not sam either
      • Feel better now? You sound - myrtle
        • interesting how you...sm - not sam either
          • If it looks like a snake, hisses like a snake, - myrtle
          • it rubs the lotion on its skin or - TTP
            • You just can't resist, can you....lol..... - sm
              • exercise - what a concept - TTP
                • Totally off topic...please read....sm - not sam either

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the enormous numbers that need to be performed.  In an age where birth control is so readily available and so reliably effective, that there are still SO MANY women seeking abortions, tells me one thing.....

People are careless, that is all.  What other conclusion could you draw?  If you only had true accidental pregnancies resulting from the small percentage failure rate of most contraceptives, the incest, the rapes, and the abortions to save a woman's life, it still wouldn't add up to a tiny fraction of the abortions we have now. 

Every time I hear someone say that that it's a woman's right to choose, or to control her own body, I can't help but hear a little voice saying... THEN CHOOSE NOT TO GET PREGNANT, BE RESPONSIBLE, DON'T HOOK UP WITH SOME LOSER IN A BACK SEAT WHILE YOU'RE LOADED UP ON BOOZE, AND CONTROL YOUR BODY. 

Why does choicie and control of one's body only begin after conception takes place?

One of the major battlegrounds for this issue concerns the use of language. In keeping with our Standards of Credibility, the verbiage used here is explanatory and precise. This means expressions such as 'pro-life' and 'pro-choice' are replaced by words that articulate specific positions. This makes certain sentences cumbersome and repetitive, but for the sake of accuracy, sacrifices in eloquence were made.

Perhaps the largest point of contention regarding terminology is the label applied to what or who is being aborted. Those who think abortion should be generally illegal often use the terms 'unborn child' and 'unborn baby'. According to Webster's College Dictionary and the International Dictionary of Medicine and Biology, the word child can apply prior to birth, but both of these sources employ the word baby only from the point of birth onwards.[1] Those who think abortion should be generally legal often use the word 'fetus', a clinical term derived from a Latin word meaning 'offspring' or 'newly delivered'.[2] Many who use this term in the media and general public are misinformed as to what it means. Dorland's Illustrated Medical Dictionary defines a fetus as:

In other words, when referring to humans, the word fetus is only applicable from nine weeks after conception until birth. Yet, numerous major news organizations have misapplied it to both before and after this period. [4] [5] Furthermore, the press rarely uses clinical terminology when referring to a pregnant woman ('gravida') or a newborn child ('neonate'). [6] [7]

The term chosen by Just Facts to describe the object of an abortion is 'preborn human'. This phrase is medically accurate, distinguishes between humans and other mammals, and conveys reality in plain language. For those who might object to the use of the word 'human', a few medical references are in order. The medical textbook, Before We Are Born - Essentials of Embryology and Birth Defects, states:

Likewise, a clinical embryology textbook bears the title Human Life Before Birth, and phrases such as "human in utero" and "human females... in utero" appear in creditable medical textbooks. [9] Moreover, it would be scientifically inconsistent to assert that a child born at 24 weeks after fertilization is a human, while one in womb at 37 weeks is not.

* The average length of a full-term pregnancy is 266 days or 38 weeks. Obstetricians normally use a figure of 40 weeks, but this is actually the time between the first day of the last menstrual period and childbirth. On average, the first day of the last menstrual period occurs 2 weeks before fertilization.[10]  [11]

* Following are facts about human development. They are organized according to the number of weeks since fertilization. Weeks after the first day of the last menstrual period (LMP) are shown in parentheses.

Fertilization (2 weeks after LMP)

Fertilization normally takes place within one day of intercourse. At fertilization, the genetic composition of a preborn human is formed. This genetic information determines gender, eye color, hair color, facial features, and influences characteristics such as intelligence and personality.[219] [220] [221]

Genetically speaking, with the exception of identical twins, once a woman conceives a preborn human, the odds against her conceiving the same one again are greater than 10⁶⁰⁰ to one. (10⁶⁰⁰ is ShortHand for the number 1 with 600 zeros after it. For comparison, there are roughly 10⁸⁰ atoms in the known universe.) [222] [223] [224] [225]

3 Weeks after Fertilization (5 weeks after LMP)

The eyes and spinal cord are visible and the developing brain has two lobes.[12] [13]

At this stage, according to the Supreme Court rulings in "Roe vs. Wade" and "Planned Parenthood vs. Casey," a pregnant woman can abort at will. (Details in the section on Constitution and Law.)

4 Weeks after Fertilization (6 weeks after LMP)

The heart is beating. The portion of the brain associated with consciousness (the cerebrum) and internal organs such as the lungs are beginning to develop and can be identified.[14] [15]

7 Weeks after Fertilization (9 weeks after LMP)

Muscles and nerves begin working together. When the upper lip is tickled, the arms move backwards.[16] The portion of the brain associated with consciousness (the cerebrum) has divided into hemispheres.[17]

[18]

9 Weeks after Fertilization (11 weeks after LMP)

More than 90% of the body structures found in a full-grown human are present. The medical classification changes from an embryo to a fetus. This dividing line was chosen by embryologists because from this point forward, most development involves growth in existing body structures instead of the formation of new ones.[19] [20]The preborn human moves body parts without any outside stimulation.[21]

10 Weeks after Fertilization (12 weeks after LMP)

All parts of the brain and spinal cord are formed. The heart pumps blood to every part of the body.[22] The whole body is sensitive to touch except for portions of the head. The preborn human makes facial expressions.[23]

At this stage, according to the Supreme Court rulings in "Roe vs. Wade" and "Planned Parenthood vs. Casey," a pregnant woman can abort at will. (Details in the section on Constitution and Law.)

11 Weeks after Fertilization (13 weeks after LMP):

[24]

12 Weeks after Fertilization (14 weeks after LMP)

Electrical signals from the nervous system are measurable. After an abortion, efforts to suckle will sometimes be observed.[25]

13 Weeks after Fertilization (15 weeks after LMP):

Ultrasound Video [26]       Windows Media Player   Real Player

14 Weeks after Fertilization (16 weeks after LMP)

The preborn human makes coordinated movements of the arms and legs.[27]

16 Weeks after Fertilization (18 weeks after LMP)

[28]

18 Weeks after Fertilization (20 weeks after LMP)

Ultrasound Video [29]       Windows Media Player   Real Player

The portion of the brain responsible for functions such as reasoning and memory (the cerebral cortex) has the same number of nerve cells as a full-grown adult.[30] [31]

At this stage, according to the Supreme Court rulings in "Roe vs. Wade" and "Planned Parenthood vs. Casey," a pregnant woman can abort at will. (Details in the section on Constitution and Law.)

20 Weeks after Fertilization (22 weeks after LMP):

The preborn human sleeps, awakes and can hear sounds.[32]

Ultrasound Video (Heart) [33]   Windows Media Player   Real Player

24 Weeks after Fertilization (26 weeks after LMP)

Taste buds are functional. The preborn human will swallow more amniotic fluid if a sweetener is added to it.[34] The grip is strong enough to hold onto an object that is moving up and down.[35] If born and given specialized care, the survival rate is more than 80%.[36]

At this stage, according to the Supreme Court's rulings in "Roe vs. Wade," "Doe vs. Bolton," and "Planned Parenthood vs. Casey," a pregnant woman can abort to preserve her "health." One example from Roe vs. Wade of what may be considered harmful to a mother's health is the "stigma of unwed motherhood." (Details in the section on Constitution and Law.)

28 Weeks after Fertilization (30 weeks after LMP)

If born and given specialized care, the survival rate is more than 95%.[37]

Premature infants born at this time are more sensitive to pain than infants who are born at 38 weeks, and infants who are born at 38 weeks are more sensitive to pain than older infants (3 -12 months old.) [38] [39]

32 Weeks after Fertilization (34 weeks after LMP)

(Premature infant – 3 days after birth)

38 Weeks after Fertilization (40 weeks after LMP)

Average point in time when humans are born. At birth, the medical classification changes from a fetus to a neonate.[40] [41] At any point prior to birth, according to the Supreme Court's rulings in "Roe vs. Wade," "Doe vs. Bolton," and "Planned Parenthood vs. Casey," a pregnant woman can abort to preserve her "health." One example from Roe vs. Wade of what may be considered harmful to a mother's health is the work of caring for a child. (Details in the section on Constitution and Law.)

* In March of 1970, a pregnant woman by the name of Norma McCorvey sued the state of Texas to challenge the constitutionality of a state law that prohibited abortion except to save the life of the mother.[42] McCorvey wanted to keep her identity secret and assumed the fictitious name Jane Roe.[43] The name of the Dallas County district attorney responsible for enforcing the law was Henry Wade. Thus, the case was entitled "Roe vs. Wade."

* Before the United States Supreme Court, the attorney for Roe argued that the Texas law was unconstitutional because it violated the Ninth and Fourteenth Amendments.[44] The Ninth Amendment reads:

The clause of the Fourteenth Amendment relevant to the argument reads:

* In support of this view, the attorney for Roe stated that "liberty to these women would mean liberty from being forced to continue the unwanted pregnancy." [47]

* During oral arguments, one of the judges asked the attorney for Roe if her case was dependent on the assertion that pre-born humans have no Constitutional rights. After some back and forth, the attorney for Roe responded:

After more back and forth, another judge said to Roe's attorney:

The attorney for Roe responded:

At this point, the Chief Justice cut her off and started to ask another question. He then interrupted himself and asked:

The attorney for Roe stated:

* The attorney for the State of Texas argued that preborn humans are protected under the Fifth Amendment.[49] The portion relevant to the argument states:

* During oral arguments, one of the judges contested this viewpoint by asserting that the Fourteenth Amendment defined what the term "person" meant, and that it did not include preborn humans.[51] The relevant clause reads:

* After some back and forth, the judge retreated from this position and said:

* The attorney for the State of Texas responded that the only way to understand what the Constitution means by the word "person" was to go to "the teachings at the time the Constitution was framed." He then quoted from William Blackstone, who is described in Simon & Shuster's New Millennium Encyclopedia as a "British jurist and legal scholar, whose work Commentaries on the Laws of England was used for more than a century as the foundation of all legal education in Great Britain and the U.S." In this work, Blackstone wrote that life is a "right" that

* To further support his position, the attorney for the state of Texas appealed to the Declaration of Independence and started to quote the following sentence from it, but was cut off by one of justices: [56]

* On January 22, 1973, the Supreme Court released its ruling. Seven of the judges ruled in favor of Roe and two of the judges opposed the ruling. The ruling overturned the laws of 30 states that prohibited abortion except to save the life of the mother.[58]

* The majority ruled these laws unconstitutional on the basis that they violated the Fourteenth Amendment, stating that it protects "the right to privacy," and that this includes "a woman's qualified right to terminate her pregnancy." [59] The relevant portion of the Fourteenth Amendment reads:

* The Fourteenth Amendment does not contain the word "privacy" or any synonym for it.[61] [62] It was adopted in 1868 to address a number of issues relevant to the Civil War, such as ensuring constitutional rights for black people.[63]

* The majority wrote that they were "not in a position to speculate" as to "when life begins" and criticized the State of Texas for "adopting one theory of life," namely, that life begins at conception.[64]

* They also:

- Used the term "potentiality of human life" in reference to preborn humans who are capable of living outside the mother's womb.[65]

- Ruled that preborn humans have no Constitutional rights.[66]

* The majority created rules regarding the types of abortion legislation that states could enact based upon the three trimesters of a typical pregnancy:

1) First trimester: States cannot prohibit abortions. They can require that abortions be done by licensed physicians, but other than this, they cannot regulate the manner in which they are performed.[67]

2) Second trimester: States cannot prohibit abortions. They can regulate the manner in which they are performed for the purpose of protecting the mother's health. The ruling cites examples of the types of regulations that are permissible. These include establishing "qualifications [for] the person who is to perform the abortion" and setting rules regarding "the facility in which the procedure is to be performed." [68]

3) Third trimester: States can prohibit abortions after "viability" (meaning the point where a preborn human is capable of living outside their mother's womb), but cannot prohibit abortions "where it is necessary, in appropriate medical judgment, for the preservation of the life or health of the mother." [69] The ruling cites specific examples of what may be considered harmful to a mother's health. They include the "stigma of unwed motherhood," the work of caring for a child, and the "distress" "associated with [an] unwanted child." [70] [71]

After listing these examples and others, the majority wrote that this portion of their ruling does not permit abortions "at whatever time, in whatever way, and for whatever reason" a woman chooses.[72] They repeated this assertion four times using varying words, but listed no example of a circumstance where abortion could be prohibited.[73]

* On the same day that the Supreme Court released Roe vs. Wade, it issued another ruling in a case entitled "Doe vs. Bolton." The same seven judges who ruled in favor of Roe also ruled in favor of Doe, and the same two judges opposed the ruling. [75] The majority wrote that this ruling and Roe v Wade "are to be read together." [76]

* In this case, the State of Georgia had a law prohibiting abortions unless the pregnancy would "seriously and permanently" injure the health of the mother.[77] A lower court struck down this law and the majority of the Supreme Court agreed. The ruling stated that abortion laws with exceptions for the health of the mother must allow for factors such as emotional health, psychological health, familial concerns, and the woman's age.[78]

* The Georgia law also required that the doctor who would perform the abortion, two other doctors, and a committee of the medical staff at the hospital where the abortion was to be done needed to agree that the abortion was necessary to preserve the health of the mother.[79] The lower court upheld this law and the Supreme Court struck it down.[80] The majority ruled that only the doctor who would perform the abortion needs to determine that the abortion was necessary to preserve the health of the mother. The abortion provider could make this decision based solely on their "best clinical judgment." [81]

* In 1992, the Supreme Court decided a case entitled "Planned Parenthood vs. Casey." In this case, the majority reaffirmed the central element of Roe vs. Wade, but did away with the "rigid trimester framework." [82]

* As in Roe vs. Wade, the majority ruled that states cannot prohibit abortions prior to viability, and laws that prohibit abortion after viability must include an exception for the "health of the mother." [83]

* Contrary to Roe vs. Wade, the majority ruled that states could enact laws that regulated abortion throughout pregnancy; as long as they did not create a substantial obstacle to obtaining an abortion. An example of what would be acceptable is a law requiring that doctors provide women with certain information before they perform abortions.[84]

* The Democratic Party is in favor of abortion being generally legal. It supports the Supreme Court ruling in Roe vs. Wade. It supports the use of taxpayer funding to perform abortions.[85]

* The Republican Party is in favor of abortion being generally illegal. It supports a Constitutional Amendment that would guarantee preborn humans the right to life. Since 1995, Republicans have proposed at least 12 amendments of this nature, all of them containing an exception to save the life of the mother.[86] [87]

* The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) supports the use of taxpayer funding to perform abortions. On their website, the ACLU poses the following rhetorical question:

And answers:

* The ACLU opposes school vouchers. One of the reasons they give for this stance is:

http://www.ipcc.ch/about/procd.htm

Above is the web site for IPCC, everything you ever wanted to know which is not much if you are a nonbeliever. They have been around since 1988 and include the World Meteorology Organization among others. It is a worldwide, inclusive organization with contributors from just about everywhere.

I don't know how global warming is seen as a step towards socialism, quite a stretch. All we want is for people to act more responsibly towards the earth we all share. Alternative fuels have been around since pre WWII. We know how to do it. We just don't and again, it's all about money all the time. What is wrong with using alternative sources of energy, it hardly makes one a socialist. If we used natural oils, say corn oil for cars.. the farmers who have suffered financial losses and loss of family farms would be back in business. Somebody would have to grow all that corn. Then it would have to be refined. Then, automobiles would have to be converted to be able to run on oil. All the automobile workers who have been laid off (13,000 Chrysler over the next 3 years - another one bites the dust) could work again. Cars would need to be built differently and the existing cars would need to be converted. Seems like the whole thing would be putting a lot of Americans to work. Whether you believe in global warming or not how could implementing these changes be harmful or turn us all into socialists. Its a good thing.

it's your choice......that's for sure....

.

It sounds to me as though you may be afraid of the truth.  I'd love to hear that you watched it and then come back here and continue giving him a free pass.

It already changed many voters' minds.

One would do.  Give me facts that he was born in the US.  Make him show his real birth certificate. 

http://www.rallycongress.com/constitutional-qualification/1244/stop-obama-constitutional-crisis/

He does not state truth and if he does, he changes it.  New middle age class now 120,000K.  He now has to kill expectations of what people think he can do if he wins.  I could go on and on.  Where did he get all this money for his campaign?  Through unauthorized prepaid credit cards and who from?  His aunt now may be living here illegal and I fear he is too.  No wonder he wants to change all illegals to legal here in the US.  There is something about him that is not right.  By the way, I am a democrate, not a pub.  I will admit he sure is a smooth talker.

myths are myths.  Believe as you wish; it doesn't matter now.  Again, how is that book and recording deal coming along?