Very true. Can anyone imagine living on minimum...sm
Posted By: oldtimer on 2008-10-21
In Reply to: What is the bank bail-out if not socialism? s/m - gourdpainter
wage and being made to feel you are not valued, never mind paying your bills. There are a LOT of working poor out there that do not look for a handout and struggle every day to be good parents. It is unbelievable to me that so many people think that the poor are all lazy and worthless. I am sure the sterotype makes the rich able to justify not paying a little more to those lazy ignorant people that just need to pull themselves up by their boot straps while I have a house for every month of the year and a yacht and never have to worry about if my light or heating bill is paid or if I have enough money to buy food for my kids. Don't get me started.
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Can you imagine living in a red state, and
having to walk down your street every day, knowing most, if not all, of your neighbors thought that way? Where trying to have an actual conversation with anyone would be like talking to a brick wall? Where you figure all the moms & dads sitting in bleachers at your kid's little league came probably wear white sheets at night? Brrrrrrrr.......
Gives me the heebie-jeebies.
Why not? The basic minimum that should be required. nm
.
she said her experience was w/ minimum wage workers
she said it herself what they were paid - minimum wage -duh
I refer to minimum wage workers because...
This type of work normally paid minimum wage. I, however, did not...
Please comment on the OP...about minimum wage workers
x
GOP-Run Senate Kills Minimum Wage Increase...sm
GOP-Run Senate Kills Minimum Wage Increase
Republican-controlled Senate derails proposed election-year increase in minimum wage
WASHINGTON, Jun. 22, 2006
By DAVID ESPO AP Special Correspondent
(AP)
(AP) The Republican-controlled Senate smothered a proposed election-year increase in the minimum wage Wednesday, rejecting Democratic claims that it was past time to boost the $5.15 hourly pay floor that has been in effect for nearly a decade.
The 52-46 vote was eight short of the 60 needed for approval under budget rules and came one day after House Republican leaders made clear they do not intend to allow a vote on the issue, fearing it might pass.
The Senate vote marked the ninth time since 1997 that Democrats there have proposed _ and Republicans have blocked _ a stand-alone increase in the minimum wage. The debate fell along predictable lines.
Americans believe that no one who works hard for a living should have to live in poverty. A job should lift you out of poverty, not keep you in it, said Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, D-Mass. He said a worker paid $5.15 an hour would earn $10,700 a year, almost $6,000 below the poverty line for a family of three.
Kennedy also said lawmakers' annual pay has risen by roughly $30,000 since the last increase in the minimum wage.
Republicans said a minimum wage increase would wind up hurting the low-wage workers that Democrats said they want to help.
For every increase you make in the minimum wage, you will cost some of them their jobs, said Sen. Johnny Isakson, R-Ga.
He described the clash as a classic debate between two very different philosophies. One philosophy that believes in the marketplace, the competitive system ... and entrepreneurship. And secondly is the argument that says the government knows better and that topdown mandates work.
The measure drew the support of 43 Democrats, eight Republicans and one independent. Four of those eight Republicans are seeking re-election in the fall.
Democrats had conceded in advance that this attempt to raise the minimum wage would fare no better than their previous attempts. At the same time, they have made clear in recent days they hope to gain support in the coming midterm elections by stressing the issue. Organized labor supports the legislation, and Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., said that contrary to some impressions, most minimum wage workers are adults, not teenagers, and many of them are women.
When the Democrats control the Senate, one of the first pieces of legislation we'll see is an increase in the minimum wage, said Kennedy.
His proposal would have increased the minimum wage to $5.85 beginning 60 days after the legislation was enacted; to $6.55 one year later; and to $7.25 a year after that. He said inflation has eroded the value of the current $5.15 minimum wage by 20 percent.
With the help of a few rebellious Republicans, House Democrats on the House Appropriations Committee succeeded in attaching a minimum wage increase last week to legislation providing funding for federal social programs. Fearing that the House would pass the measure with the increase intact, the GOP leadership swiftly decided to sidetrack the entire bill.
I am opposed to it, and I think a vast majority of our (rank and file) is opposed to it, House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, said Tuesday.
Pressed by reporters, he said, There are limits to my willingness to just throw anything out on the floor.
On Wednesday, his spokesman, Kevin Madden, said Boehner has told fellow Republicans the House will have to deal with this some way. He said no decisions had been made.
While Democrats depend on organized labor to win elections, Republicans are closely aligned with business interests that oppose any increase in the federal wage floor or would like changes in the current system.
Sen. Mike Enzi, R-Wyo., chairman of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee, offered an alternative that proposed a minimum wage increase of $1.10 over 18 months, in two steps.
The increase was coupled with a variety of provisions offering regulatory or tax relief to small businesses, including one to exempt enterprises with less than $1 million in annual receipts from the federal wage and hour law entirely. The current exemption level is $500,000, and a Republican document noted the amount had lagged behind inflation.
Additionally, Republicans proposed a system of optional flextime for workers, a step that Enzi said would allow employees, at their discretion, to work more than 40 hours one week in exchange for more time off the next. Unions generally oppose such initiatives, and the Republican plan drew 45 votes, with 53 in opposition.
MMVI The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
Posible new "boon" to the economy? Higher minimum wages??.....PSM
I was just thinking, we did a lot of discussion yesterday about welfare reform, the bloated welfare roles that we have now, and how to end it. How about passing a DECENT, HONEST, REALISTIC minimum wage act that is based on the present economy, the proposed future economay, and will make it more profitable for an American to get a fair-paying job on which he can feed his family, pay his REASONABLE mortgage, pay his bills, etc., instead of having the minimum wage so low that it is actually more profitable for many families to say on welfare, medicaide, and food stamps, along with subsidised housing AND NOT have to juggle three low-paying jobs to do it? Don't you think that if American workers felt they were more faily paid, were being compensated fairly for their efforts, and would bring home enough wages each week to live within comfortable means, that more and more folk would jump off the roles and into a job (of course, we first need the part of the stimulus package to address keeping our companies solvent and employing). Just a thought!!! 
LOL. I can only imagine the
campaign ads that would have emerged from the Clinton campaign against Ms. Now-where-did-I-put-my-notes Pirro.
Hillary hasn't impressed me much lately, though, and I truly can't imagine myself voting for her if she runs for President.
I would imagine...
the conservative magazine was interested because of the infighting that starts during the primaries...when the Democrats start taking potshots at each over over the bow. I have no trouble believing the Clinton campaign leaked it. While he was not in a medrasa (although the source I saw who went and investigated it was a reporter from CNN, so hardly impartial), it was a Muslim school. I also found it odd that the report said it could not be substantiated rather than it was a lie. Usually CNN goes big with the it was a lie and I did not hear that from this reporter, which makes me think there is more than they are telling. All that being said, I don't see how he can have first hand knowledge of Muslims and Islam if his father left when he was a boy and he was educated in non-Muslim schools, as he and everyone else seems to be saying, trying to distance themselves from anything Muslim. How is he more qualified than any other American politician to talk about Islam and Muslims? After all, he is not a Muslim...right? You aren't sure either, apparently. However, if he was, that is not the reason I would not vote for him. There are several others and more important ones in my estimation.
Trying To Imagine . . .
An Atheist President
I'd like to do more than imagine it. sm
I'd like it to be a reality - again (see below). Think of it, a president who bases his/her decisions on facts, reason, and logic rather than beliefs in a supernatural fantasy (i.e., the Bush administration).
Actually, presidents Lincoln, Jefferson, and I think Madison were athiests or deists. They certainly weren't christians, and neither were many of the founding fathers. And even those that were (christians) were, above all, secularists. I find it tragic that we've gotten so far away from that.
Imagine
JM in a meeting with Russian or Iraq leaders about nuclear arms. JM gets mad, calls the leader a "#@@#$#" and shoves him. Lord love a duck.
Just imagine a man outside
by his car and a young child walking by and the man says to the young child, "I've got some candy. Do you want some candy? You have to get into my car if you want a piece of candy."
Or how about Obamanation groupies.....Do you want change. You have to get onto my bus and register to vote for change. Remember Uhhbama is change. HAIL OBAMA! McCain bad.....Uhhbama good.
Just imagine
the US government decided to rid itself of its low income housing woes by exporting it to the Indian reservations or 50 miles inside the Mexican or Canadia border. The could simply establish exclusive use infrastructure (roads, water, electricity, sewage), build a housing development, subsidize loans and pay ghetto residents a bounty to pack up and move out of the country.
Do not kid yourself into believing that Israel's splitering of the West Bank is some random accident. This is just one more of a long list of methods they have been using to shrink the geography right out from under the Palestinians to the point where it can no longer support the population and force their flight into the diapora, all neat and tidy. Why do you think they fight so hard to prevent the right of return?
Another lie - imagine that
Lie after lie after lie after attack after attack after attack.
This is just not true.
I definitely cannot imagine
a guy with multiple wives having the love and commitment for all of them that a person with only one spouse has.
And I certainly can't imagine........... sm
a man loving a man or a woman a woman in a sexual way and wanting to be married in the eyes of the law.....but that's just me. I guess all things are possible.
Certainly, a man with multiple wives, I would think, would not be able to give equal love and committment to just one. His attentions would be divided and I don't even want to think about the in-fighting amongst the co-wives. BUT who is to say that all marriages are based on love alone?
I can now imagine what Obama
felt when he was linked, ever so tenuously, with VP Cheney.
I just can't imagine that happening.
I mean....wouldn't that look bad for the Dems for the VP to just say....I don't want to do this....I've changed my mind and then this close to the election start with a new running mate? Besides....Hill doesn't want to play second fiddle to Barry. Personally, I don't think true Hill supporters will like her lpaying second fiddle to Barry either. I will be truly surprised if this happens. I guess I will believe it if I see it but not until then.
Can you imagine all these folks
worrying about the pubs wasting 150,000 of their little handful of funds? You got Obama there who has spent more $$ than anyone in political history, and isn't near through yet. Now, how many hungry children could he have fed? Remember, this is another one of his lies where he first agreed to accept public funding, however.
You'd be wrong to imagine that.
Having been born in a silver-sppon neighborhood, I can tell you the best thing that ever happened to me is the divorce that busted me, my sisters, brother and mom back down into the middle class. Money was nothing but misery for family members trying to compete with it for attention. Be careful what you ask for.
Thanks for the visual. Having fun trying to imagine it.
x
Can you imagine what his life would be like if the
Life is hard enough for kids, even when everything goes as planned. The schoolyard is a cruel, cruel place.
And what about every time he does something wrong, or sasses back at his mom? There will be the either implied or spoken insinuation that it came from his dad's bad seed.
Hard to imagine how this could
**'escalate violence' in the region since nobody has safe in those waters for years. Should we be like the woman abused by her husband for years, who doesn't want him arrested because she doesn't want to 'make him mad' ?
So these lawless jerks hijack, steal, kidnap, threaten murder, then swear vengeance when we oppose them? http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/piracy
......One of the pirates pointed an AK-47 at the back of Phillips, who was tied up and in "imminent danger" of being killed when the commander of the nearby USS Bainbridge made the split-second decision to order his men to shoot, Vice Adm. Bill Gortney said. The lifeboat was being towed by the Bainbridge at the time, he said.
A fourth pirate was in discussions with naval authorities about Phillips' fate when the rescue took place. He is in U.S. custody and could face could face life in a U.S. prison.
**"This could escalate violence in this part of the world, no question about it," said Gortney, the commander of U.S. Naval Forces Central Command.
Abdullahi Lami, one of the pirates holding the Greek ship anchored in the Somali town of Gaan, said: "Every country will be treated the way it treats us. In the future, America will be the one mourning and crying," he told The Associated Press. "We will retaliate (for) the killings of our men.......
Imagine that; the usual suspects who
more to offer than more of the same swiftboating as the Kool-Aid drunks applaud them.
So just imagine how much "better" things will be for all
In our 'great' economy, we'll have:
- Gasoline that is unaffordable to all but the wealthy.
- Blackened coastlines from offshore drilling.
- Few living-wage jobs left in the U.S.
- More foreign missles (and passenger jets) aimed at our cities.
- The likely loss of a woman's control over her own reproductive system.
- Even less separation of church-and-state than there is now.
- Further disappearance of our country's middle-class (the ones they expect to carry our economy on its shoulders). There will be the rich, and there will be the working poor, and with the current state of housing and rental rates, more of them will probably graduate to the status of 'car-dweller'.
Yeah, it all looks like a rosy future, alright.
I don't imagine you bothered to read...
entire thread...but why would you? lol.
The clip has been pulled - imagine that!
They sure are trying their hardest to keep what it is they are about out of the news.
As the infamous Indiana Jones stated.....
"Nazi's.....I hate these guys."
I cannot imagine not knowing how many homes I have
They are just living in a parallel universe. He talks big but I can tell when McBush speaks that he really doesn't "feel" the pain of the middle class or heaven forbid, the poor or the seniors on fixed incomes. That is something he will never have to feel.
Now 120K, imagine that. DH makes that and more on his own...so much
for me having to work any longer (now I can wait by the mailbox for a check!). What a country where you get penalized for hard work and doing the right thing.
I'm agreeing with your post - imagine that :-)
However, I couldn't find where anyone called you "stupid". Someone who just put the initials sm above called me "stupid".
Here's my thing when I say O worshippers. I am not talking about all of you. There are a few that come on this board and cut down anyone who doesn't "google" and drool at the mention of Obama's name. They can't tell you his policies or ideas or anything. They just go on and on about how we're all trying to spoil their joy and glee that Obama was voted and their dancing in circles. Well that's all fine and good. When I say O worshippers/lovers I'm talking about people who know nothing about Obama's policies. I've read his policies and plans - I don't like them. That's my opinion. When people bash me for no good reason except that I'm not blindly dancing around in circles over-joyed that Obama got in and when I post some serious questions about his policies and ideas and get bashed for it, those are the people I call O worshippers/lovers.
This whole issue of political families "inheriting" their relatives seat is outright disgusting. There are so many qualified people to fill the seats and what do we get someone holding a seat for Biden's son when he returns from his tour of duty and it will just be handed to him without him having to campaign for it, or another Kennedy in the seat just cos her name is Kennedty and the most laughable one Chelsea? I am losing all interest in politics because all I see is corruption. They are treating their positions in the senate as though they are royalty and the position just handed down to their relatives. If I never see or hear of another Kennedy, Clinton, or Bush it will be too soon. There are so many unknown people in politics that are really good people, but they get tossed aside. Why? Cos they don't have money.
As for your last paragraph regarding how can anyone defend the Bush administration and what Cheney said, etc. All I can say is I agree, I agree, I agree 100%. Although I do have to say it goes even farther then those two ninnies - there were plenty of other players who had a say in this farce of a war, and the reason why or economy is going into a depression.
I think he's more deceptive than people imagine........
nm
I like it here. Besides, mostly all they discuss there is current events. Imagine that. nm
I can't begin to imagine what the parents must feel.
I would be so enraged if I were in their position that I'm not sure what I'd do. I hope I would remember that keeping my family together and supporting my child (or children if there are siblings) has to be a priority, but on the other hand, to know that this monster is free to walk the streets and do this to other children... I'm not sure I wouldn't do whatever was necessary to put him either behind bars or underground. I certainly couldn't condemn a parent in that situation who made that choice.
I really hope there is enough uproar over this to change things. Otherwise, what choice do people have to protect their children but to take the law into their own hands? These judges (and legislators, for that matter) need to realize that, like guards in a prison, government rules by consent of the governed. Fail to protect the governed or to enforce reasonable laws in a just manner, and the governed will assume control one way or another. I am not an anarchist by any means, but law and order is one of the most basic governmental responsibilities. We can argue til the cows come home about everything else we would or wouldn't like the government involved in, but if they fail on too large a scale in this most basic duty, vigilantism and anarchy become inevitable.
Miss Thang, I imagine that you could offend
nm
Talking about Florida, I can only imagine how things would have been...sm
different in our country if only AL Gore had been president for the last 8 years instead of George Bush.
One would imagine so he can get bipartisan 1st-hand info
It is appropriate that he continues exactly on the course he is following for the moment...cabinet building, prioritizing and preparing initiatives for day one so as to hit the gound running.
Yeah, think things are bad with Obama? Imagine
nm
where im currently living is okay... but
Nevada is hit HARD. South Carolina is doing fine as far as i can tell, but ive only been here two months.
my problem is my mortgage is in Nevada... so in turn, im not doing so great either.
hope everyone is doing as good as they can!
WOW! Then you are definitely living
in the wrong place and at the wrong time. Because from here on, you'll be told exactly what to do and when, and probably how you're supposed to feel about it.
Told what amount of money it is 'seemly' for you to earn, how much you MUST surrender to maintain the lifestyles of others, and how much you may be permitted to keep - if you promise to spend it properly. Told how much energy it is politically correct for you to use (please drive an approved vehicle) and what modern conveniences it is more 'green' to do without. Told not to think too much: 'The science is settled. The debate is over.' Told what medical tests and procedures it will be proper for you to receive and which (so very sorry) it would be better for society as a whole for you to forego, because there is only so much to go around. Told for your own good what to eat and taxed extra on the improper items you choose. (Unless, apparently, you receive food stamps, in which case limiting your choice would be unnecessarily judgmental.)
Perhaps some will see all this as gentle correction from a benevolent parent, but this micromanagement sneaking in incrementally cloaked in a smily face will not really make me feel better about being told what to do.
Imagine that simple statement being recited by a white man about blacks.
It would have been labeled a racist remark.
They ain't living unless they are being condescending
and down right vulgar (hence the expletives tonight). You're right.. the only time they have anything going here is when we come over. They have nothing constructive to talk about when they aren't looking down their noses at conservatives who question their statements or bashing Bush. It's a big yawnfest
That's why I'm using the moniker leftist/lib basher. The best way to rile them up is to call them by what they call themselves. Oh, wait a minute. They're progressives now. They'll be progressives until we call them that then they'll say we're calling them names and change it again. Yes, they have tender widdle feelings.
What I do for a living is immaterial...
although since I post on this forum it should be obvious I am in the transcription industry. What is to you if I reply to every post? Did I miss the meeting where that was outlawed or you were named moderator?
What makes you think I don't put my energy toward making a difference? Whether I do or not is also immaterial...and with all due respect...none of your business.
Do you not believe in freedom of speech? If you don't like my posts, don't read them.
Your living in your own little world
Anyone who doesn't believe this is happening are living in their own world. Am sure you probably believe what the government tells you also. We are living in end times, however, the religious fanatics need to cool it as a lot of people don't believe in the "left behind" garbage that is spewed. Another prime example of lies to keep the people preoccupied.
Some of us have to make a living.
Got kids. Need to cook and clean and transcribe, balance the checkbook, pay bills, clip coupons and grocery shop, feed the kitties, watch news and fact check to stay informed. Chat room cat fights are low priority for me, especially with posters like yourself and sam, unlike those who stay ready to pounch 24/7.
i saw that too. she is living proof
that a fetus is more than a glob of cells.
For those that feel that way, try living in another
A country that has been divided and divided again but still always one trying to overthrow the other. Remember Georgia? Russian leaders can't leave them alone. Georgia separated and became their own country but still their neighbors want to continually cause them trouble..... the U.S. can't go that way unless you don't mind that kind of war in your own back yard.
You need to do some history study of nations that have split and all they do is war, not because the majority of people don't want peace, but because they leaders of each individual country always seems to be greedy and want to rule EVERYONE, not just their own country.
What does living in the northeast have to do with anything...
it's expensive pretty much anywhere you live. Put your kids to work if they are old enough, especially if they go to school, to help pay for that expensive food bill.
I agree...Imagine the brave soul who would give an oppositional opinion...sm
It would be career suicide IMHO.
And those of us who are conservative are living in fear that...
our courts will further erode our society to the point that everything goes. Heck, one third of the country already has to live with the notion that their 12-year-old can consent to an abortion without our knowledge (thanks to the 6th circuit court in California, legalize gay marriage without letting "we the people" decide how we want our society (yes, 78% of Americans are against it), and I could go on and on. Do you like the fact that another priviate citizen can now take your property just because HIS use of that property would generate more income for the government? Sounds like socialism is rapidly becoming fascism to me. You can thank the imminent domain decision to those wonderful progressives on the court. Yes, let's hope we get another Ruth Bader Ginsburg on the court so our country can continue it's slide down the toilet.
Well, Mr. Clinton isn't living too shabbily himself
I think you better step back and rethink some of your claims before you say that Republicans are the only ones living in luxury etc. A funeral is a funeral not a political soapbox. Carter and Kennedy ought to be ashamed of themselves for making a memorial service into a political bash fest of the President who was sitting right there. How classless. You're absolute hatred of Bush is coming through to the fact that you can't see the mockery that was made of Mrs. King's funeral.
President Carter should be embarassed, but I don't think embarassment is a trait of liberals anymore.
Camera face time, and bashing Bush that's all that matters to them. They are blinded to decorum.
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