This plan is not going to affect this debt
Posted By: MTfromLA on 2009-02-14
In Reply to: News flash....(sm) - Just the big bad
growth rate at all, it will continue to grow on a daily basis. This stimulus package will just be added to the total debt. And, actually we do NOT KNOW THAT THIS MONEY WILL BENEFIT people. At this point, we can only pray that it will, we have no other choice. Time will tell.
Complete Discussion Below:  marks the location of current message within thread
The messages you are viewing
are archived/old.
To view latest messages and participate in discussions, select
the boards given in left menu
Other related messages found in our database
So how would this plan affect you?
If it doesn't apply to you, then nothing about your mortgage would change. How is that unfair to you? Would it be more fair to charge the taxpayers, including you, whether in you're arrears or not or owning a mortgage or not, the $700 billion dollars?
I don't get what about this is upsetting to you. You already have a better rate and your credit must be great. Any resolution to this problem should not result in someone making out better than before the problem started.
We can and do affect this planet.
While I agree that we can't exactly know how much we have to do with changing cycles on the planet, there is simply NO doubt that we have had a profound impact upon it. Even when I was a kid there were springs we could drink from and rivers we could swim in without fear of chemical burns. The fields were loaded with turtles and other creatures, every pond and creek was alive wtih frogs and tadpoles and fish. Ask your grandparents what they remember the countryside being like before the supreme arrogance of corporate policy poisoned every water source we have. There was a time that tuna fish didn't have mercury in it. On and on. Don't dismiss the concern many have over the impact we DO have on our planet as arrogance - we are certainly having a BAD BAD impact globally.
And true, not just us. However, America along with other industrialized nations and bankers is certainly complicit in the globalization movement (i.e., move into other lands, usurp the resouces from the native people, give them toxic sludge for their crops as a sort of side joke, suck out all their groundwater, make the corporations richer). We certainly don't stand against it politically or financially.
While the planet may survive the sweeping changes its most prolific environment-altering parasites inflict upon it, we probably will not. Just look at Mars if you don't think a planet can die. Regardless of why, it's certainly dead enough. So are we going to wait to be shaken off like pesky fleas - or are we going to make some effort to SUSTAIN our world and keep it in balance rather than continuously insulting it to the point where we DESERVE to be exterminated? Some of us don't have a deep-seated death wish. Some of us don't think money is more important than good living. Some of us are actually fond of this planet. Excuse US for thinking of it that way.
It does affect your paycheck...
Gays marrying gives them the same benefits and tax breaks as married couples. That means they can be insured through each other's workplace at the subsidized rates, which of course will affect how much employers subsidize you insurance. It also gives them married tax breaks and social security status. So, gay marriage does inadvertently affect your paycheck in a roundabout way.
How does this affect me personally?
AIG is losing more and more money every day... we all know that. My story is that my BF is on Worker's Comp for an injury. He will never be back to what he was, but is as good as he is going to get until he can have a knee replacement, which they will not because of his young age. So we are thinking it is time to settle with the insurance company - who is backed by AIG...
They are already offering us a lot less than what we expected because they say they don't have money to give, but what happens if we hold out and then the company goes belly up? Do we just lose out completely then?
Can WC go belly up? I mean, is it backed by the government since it is mandated by the government and he will keep getting his benefits if he does not settle or are we looking at maybe losing even his weekly check and medical benefits and so we need to take what we can get while we can? 
Listen, this IS going to affect us, too. Watch as the...sm
tax rates are raised by end of the year that will affect all paying taxpayers on next year's returns! Unfortunately we are ALL going to feel this, in spite of that "generous" $13.00 that we will supposedly see on our checks.
Well, then you're lucky! Maybe it doesn't affect
nm
Roberts: Iraq Will Affect Future War Votes
Fool me once, shame on you....etc.
I feel better knowing Congress is smart enough to not believe BU_ _ SH _ _ twice from this farce of a president.
Roberts: Iraq Will Affect Future War Votes
Experience With Faulty Data Has Made Senators More Wary, Panel Chairman Says
By Walter Pincus
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, November 14, 2005; A04
The Republican chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence said yesterday that one lesson of the faulty prewar intelligence on Iraq is that senators would take a hard look at intelligence before voting to go to war.
I think a lot of us would really stop and think a moment before we would ever vote for war or to go and take military action, Sen. Pat Roberts (Kan.) said on Fox News Sunday.
We don't accept this intelligence at face value anymore, he added. We get into preemptive oversight and do digging in regards to our hard targets.
He said that agreement has been reached on the Phase 2 review that the intelligence panel is doing to look into whether the Bush administration exaggerated or misused prewar intelligence. The review may not be finished this year, he said.
The intelligence panel vice chairman, Sen. John D. Rockefeller IV (D-W.Va.), also appearing on Fox, called the review absolutely useful because if it is the fact that they [the Bush administration] created intelligence or shaped intelligence in order to bring American opinion along to support them in going to war, that's a really bad thing -- it should not ever be repeated.
Appearing on CNN's Late Edition, national security adviser Stephen J. Hadley said the White House is supporting the study, adding: I think that what you're going to find is that the statements by the administration had backing at the time from accepted intelligence sources.
He said that when administration statements turned out to be wrong, that was because the underlying intelligence was not true, but that's not the same as manipulating intelligence, and that is not misleading the American people.
Sen. Carl M. Levin (D-Mich.), appearing with Roberts on Late Edition, said that Iraq became the center of terrorism after the March 2003 invasion.
I'm afraid we're going to see Iraq is not only the center of the war on terror, which it was not before we attacked Iraq, but now it is going to, I'm afraid, export it.
He added that Iraq has become the heartland of terrorism. It was not before we attacked.
Levin, a member of both the Senate intelligence committee and Armed Services Committee, has been a leading critic of the Bush administration's handling of the war.
Levin also said that the United States must get allies, as many as we can, including in the Muslim world because this is a form of fanatic Islam which has to be defeated by the moderate Islamic people.
In a column in yesterday's Washington Post, former senator John Edwards (N.C.), the Democratic vice presidential candidate in 2004, said the failures of the Bush administration turned Iraq into a far greater threat than it ever was. It is now a haven for terrorists [and] has made fighting the global war on terrorist organizations more difficult rather than less.
The president and his senior aides have said since before the invasion that Washington went to war primarily because Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction and was a threat to the United States and its neighbors because of his connection to terrorists. Once fighting began, they argued that Iraq was the central front in the battle against terrorism.
In his Veterans Day speech on Friday, the president turned his original argument around, saying, The terrorists regard Iraq as the central front in their war against humanity, and therefore, We must recognize Iraq as the central front in our war against the terrorists.
I don't see how it can affect her ability to read questions and sit and listen to answers - nm
x
G. Gordon Liddy says he hopes Sotomayor menstruation doesn't affect judgment
A major conservative radio host, G. Gordon Liddy, attacked President Obama's Supreme Court nominee Thursday in perhaps one of the most grotesque politically-oriented tirades in recent times.
"Let’s hope that the key conferences aren’t when she’s menstruating or something, or just before she’s going to menstruate," Liddy said. "That would really be bad. Lord knows what we would get then."
Liddy is no stranger to controversy -- in fact, he spent four years in jail for his role in the Nixon-era Watergate burglaries. His radio show is syndicated in 160 markets and on the Sirius Radio network.
Liddy also attacked Sotomayor for her affiliation with LA Raza, a Hispanic civil rights group (which was also maligned Thursday by former GOP Rep. Tom Tancredo, who called it the Latino KKK). Liddy referred to the Spanish language as "illegal alien."
"I understand that they found out today that Miss Sotomayor is a member of La Raza, which means in illegal alien, 'the race,'" Liddy quipped. "And that should not surprise anyone because she’s already on record with a number of racist comments."
"And everybody is cheering because Hispanics and females have been, quote, underrepresented, unquote," Liddy added later. "And as you pointed out, which I thought was quite insightful, the Supreme Court is not designed to be and should not be a representative body."
The comments were noted by the blog ThinkProgress. Audio of Liddy's comments follow.
The following audio is The G. Gordon Liddy Show , broadcast on May 28, 2009.
Who put us in debt?
Who borrowed all that money from China? 42% of the bill is Republican proposed tax cuts. The last stimulus proved that tax cuts don't work (Under George's watch- helped his base, though). The money is either saved or used to pay off debt, neither of which help the economy. Maybe you ought to look over your shoulder and see where the real blame lies. Obama is doing the best he can and all you racists can do is trounce him at every turn. And don't even bother bleating that you're not racist as I see no other reason why you would hug the last administration so fiercely and hate Obama with so much venom. Obama hasn't been able to do ANYTHING yet. Both sides of the aisle wrote that stimulus package - so figure it out.
debt you can believe in
I can only hope our economists can somehow separate Obama's debt, which will kill us all in our sleep, from Bush's debt, which made us all rich and strong ("Reagan proved deficits don't matter," as VP Richard Cheney famously said--haha, I can't use his usual first name in the post; how stupid is that?).
No, wait. What I actually hope is that the difference between governing and politics keeps becoming more and more visible, so that people are forced to think outside their usual assumptions about what their political party stands for.
No. Remembering the debt we owe all of those
Camera angles, selective footage, media spin do not paint a true full picture. When the emphasis is put on the guys you describe and the rest of the event is never broadcast, it is not be accident. They strive to create the images and impressions which you now express. What is more pertinent here is the anger you see there, in these posts, between the parties and all over our country after 8 years under the regime. This is not blame. It is statement of fact. It's not pretty, granted. But to really undestand what you are looking at takes a little more than a sound byte or a drive-by post.
Considering our national debt is now......... sm
sitting at, what, $3 trillion dollars, I doubt government oversight would be of much benefit to the auto industry. In fact, I kind of feel like the government really has the audacity to ask a private industry to prove a solvent plan when the government can't even balance their own books. Either way, the auto industry is going under. It's just a matter of whether it is now or 6 months from now.
True. We are in debt already. Let's just
and now our country will go bankrupt. Depression, here we come.
True. We are in debt already. Let's just
and then our country will go bankrupt. Depression, here we come. Although some cities are already feeling depression. Cannot wait for our treasury guy who does not know how to do TurboTax is going to say how much more debt (money) we will need coming this week. I betcha the stocks will fall between 300-400.
Wow. New jobs coming. Cannot wait. Maybe a 5',2" and 110 pound woman can apply working on building bridges, paving roads, building a train track from CA to NV. Then the jobs will be finished for me and then what?
She ran our state into debt.
SHE is an extremist.
If you are talking about the war debt, your congress did...
when they voted to go to Iraq. Would not have passed without Dems' support as well.
Our country was not in debt with Clinton but it was sm
when bill got in office and saw the mess bush senior made, it had to be dealt with.... just as this mess GW made will take years to clean up.... but Clinton did get us in the black. Barack is going to use that same tax formula and that is why he said you will pay no more than what you paid in taxes under Clinton. That goes for the rich too.
HC's campaign debt would suggest that
dontchathink?
Will never last. Obama is putting us in debt we may
nm
So, you don't care if we are in debt to the tune
of $9T over the next 10 years????? You really want your children, grandchildren and probably your great-grandchildren to pay for mistakes that did not have to take place in the first place?
You're not wasting tea, you're wasting the little tag on the tea bag. How hard is it to let the government know you are furious with their antics? I just don't agree it's a waste of time.
Some of us (not me yet) are in the less fortunate boat and not getting any help at all while those in power pocket our money. It's time to stop the nonsense and hold those accountable for their actions. It's time to let the government know we don't want to be told how to live anymore. Freedom is not free anymore. It costs a lot of money and our freedoms are slowly being whittled away one by one. I want to see my grandchildren enough those freedoms, not wind up being told how to live, what to eat, where and when to work, etc.
Whew! Sorry. Am venting. I'll get off my soapbox now.
Bush sunk himself and our country......DEBT
v
Democratic = surplus - Republican = debt
Based on Congressional accounting rules, at the end of his presidency Clinton reported a surplus of $559 billion.
After 8 years of Bush...As of September 2008, the total U.S. federal debt was approximately $9.7 trillion.
Has anyone watched "Money as Debt" video?
It's a 47 minute animated video you can find on line (I believe it's on You Tube as well as other places.) I watched most of it once and it's just unbelievable what the banks have been doing for YEARS and it explains a lot of why (at least around where I live) there are new banks with names I've never heard of popping up on every corner and in every new strip mall.
It also goes a long way in explaining how these banks are in such trouble and how they're pulling everyone down with them.
Obama will make sure our children pay for this debt
nm
Any ideas on how paying down too much debt could be a terrorist threat?nm
And what about the debt he inheriteed from George W. Bush, take off the blinders......sm
and they say WE have been drinking Kool-Aid? WE had a president who could hardly color inside the lines, was an inarticulate moron, catered to special interests, led us into an unjustfied war with Iraq (HELLO, IT WAS THE TALIBAN/OSAMA IN AFGHANISTAN ON 9/11), we lost all respect around the globe, and he took a balanced budget from President Clinton and got us into trillions of dollars worth of debt, all the while allowing all bhe banking deregulation, feeding the GREED machine in this country. The past administration was a TRAGEDY perpetrated on the American people, so you folks can keep drinking your Republican Red Kool-Aid, keep prematurely judging this president as you lick your lips praying for his failure, which by the way means RUIN for you, me, and the rest of the nation. The man is willing to TRY, to compromise, and he has only been in office barely three weeks. All the harshness against Obama is misdirected anger and pique that the Republicans were ousted. IMHO. Saying stuff over and over DOES NOT MAKE IT SO!!!
Yeah, lets spend billions, go into more debt while
nm
What a snooty post, no,we have PAID OFF all debt, own our home,,,,sm
outright, thank you, own both our cars, but when you are caring for three kids, taking care of their needs, paying about $300.00 a week on food, I have several serious illnesses with lots of meds, we have high costs here in the North East, AND we are putting money into 401K and retirement, sometimes we DO have to wait a day or two to buy something, it is called A BUDGET, it is called self-restraint in spending, and you, my friend, need some serious counseling in compassion, communication, ....do you even have friends with that kind of attitude??? what is your problem exactly?
Dont talk to me about Debt. Dems wanted loans for
nm
Plan B.
I can't imagine Bush releasing funds intended for the banks and insurance companies to be released to the auto industry without imposing more stringent conditions on the UAW workers than the republican caucus and parochial southern senators have already tried to enact. Gettelfinger stands behind his "bankruptcy is not an option" statement. If Bush does not step forward, looks like liquidation could be just around the corner. JMHO.
bad plan
I do believe our senators need to go focus on this crisis, but, a few hours spared for a debate is not a waste of time. The election is close and people need to hear what both of the candidates have to say.
More on O's plan for
What I had in mind was his proposal to eliminate capital gains taxes for start-up and small businesses, the making work pay tax credit to help reduce the double taxation paid by self-employed (that "special" self-employment tax you pay if you are an IC) and the proposed $250 million annual investment in the National Network of Business Incubators designed to increase the number and size of small businesses.
Here's part of the answer to the earlier question about small businesses and health insurance cost/fine. He proposes a Small Business Health Tax Credit program of up to 50% of the premiums they pay for health care benefits for their employees. If you want to read more, here's the link:
http://www.barackobama.com/pdf/SmallBusinessFINAL.pdf
Under O's plan, you will keep more of it.
x
That's not a bad plan
But the article itself says that France does not have socialized medicine - it's something completely different, especially with the lowered malpractice insurance and the tuition-free universities. I don't see that anything like that would be set up in the US, do you? It's not a bad idea, though. Definitley something to think about.
LOL. I like that plan.
.
God has a plan for everything
His main objective is that none of us die but, as loving as He is, He gives us choices. Many of us will make the wrong choice and die for it.
health plan
I have an idea, why doesnt Bush stop waging immoral wars and use our tax dollars for something constructive and life saving, like health coverage for those who die each year without it? You know why I would love a universal health plan? Because I care about my brother and sister and I care about making every Americans life better. Of course, you conservatives care about no one but yourselves. You make a few bucks, buy a home in a gated community, take the other streets so you dont pass the ghetto..and yet you claim you are christian..that is the most hypocritical statement of all. Do you not realize if Jesus walked this earth today, he would be a liberal democrat, helping the poor, the starving, the sick, the homeless, accepting all. Im so glad Im a liberal democrat. I dont think I could look at myself in the mirror or get a good nights sleep knowing my ideology is actually harming America, not helping it one bit.
Obama's plan
I assume you watched both conventions????? I watched the Dems and now I'm watching the Pubs. I am an INDEPENDENT. I would support Obama were it not for my research of the church he has been associated with for 20 years. This church, in my humble opinion, belongs to an extreme, radical, racist group. We don't need that in the White House. With the exception of illegal immigration, he pretty much addressed all the things that I feel are important to the future of my children and grandchildren and were it not for his affiliation with his chosen church, I would probably vote for him. . At least he had the good sense to select a person as his running mate who actually might be "ready on day one" to lead this country.
Secondly, again in my humble opinion, McCain has a few screws loose rattling around upstairs. He answers every question, even about how many houses he owns, with something like, "well, the longest time I spent anywhere was when I was a POW." Other than that it has been all about bashing Obama and his not having "experience." Then look what he did. Picked a little-known female who has been abroad exactly once and tries to pass her off as "experienced." Truth: She is a female and her state is the second largest producer of oil. Bush governed the biggest oil producing state. Enjoying those prices at the pumps? To this point all the pub speakers have pushed McCain's war record. What????? Do we need more war? I think a peacemaker would be better.
Now, before anyone pounces on me, I support NEITHER of these candidates and NEITHER will receive my vote. Either way, the middle class Americans, to which I expect most MTs belong, lose. Our government will change when and if the majority of Americans quit using their heads as a hatrack for the Democrat and Republican parties, kick them out and bring back government "of the people, by the people and for the people." Won't happen this time but maybe next time won't be too late.
OK. Let's rephrase. How does JM's new plan
x
Obama's tax plan
First of all, let me say I was undecided on this election until yesterday. Obama's tax plan scares me to death. I heard him on an interview yesterday, and he said that the top 5% of the country could *afford to help out those less fortunate to us*, meaning those that make above $200,000. He also said that someone making under $45,000 would *probably* not have to pay income taxes, because all the tax revenue would be generated from the top 5% of the country, again, who could *afford* to help out his fellow man.
So, here's my question. If I work my BUTT off making a great living for my family, who the heck is he to say I have to share it? My husband and I put ourselves through school to get a good education for ourselves, searched for good jobs, worked more than one sometimes, and enjoy or standard of living, because we worked hard for it and EARNED it. How dare he suggest that I have to share that with ANYONE, just because they dont' have as much. We give to quite a few neighborhood organizations and national charities, we do not keep every penny for ourselves.
If he does get elected and puts this new plan in place, why would people work hard to make a good living if quite a bit chunk of it is going to be taken away? Why not just sit back, work as little as you want, stay under that $40,000 radar, not pay income taxes, and have the government give you some other *rich* guy's money because you don't have as much?
This really made my mind up for me. It's time this county taught some personal responsibility and accountability, and I do not think he is the one for the job!
And so how exactly does McCain plan to fix
He could sell Alaska to the Japanese. They need the land & the natural resources, and they most definitely have the money.
McCain's plan...
http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/19ba2f1c-c03f-4ac2-8cd5-5cf2edb527cf.htm
Not as described above.
Obama's Plan:
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/healthcare/
They seem very similar to me...big difference is Obama wants the government to control it and McCain wants individuals to control their own health care. I don't see a problem with that.
Which is why I am still voting McCain.
if you plan on voting
you will need to keep things like OBAMA and OSAMA straight. The political system was based on the assumption that voters would know the difference between a tall black man running for president and a tall man in a sheet running for cover. Study up. Only a few more weeks . . . I'm betting you can do it.
Do either of the candidates have a plan
for this financial crisis that does not involve the taxpayers bailing out the US?
You are correct about his plan not being...sm
socialized medicine. I don't think the majority of people have insurance through their employers anymore. If you don't you will be insured based on what you can afford to pay, and you will keep your own doctor. Vermont already has such a plan and it works great.
His plan includes ---
He wants to provide coverage for everyone that needs it. If you have coverage already, then you keep it. If you don't have coverage, then you are able to buy the same coverage the federal employees have. He only wants to mandate that a family have coverage for their children and you can get it anywhere you want to.
My state already is using almost the same plan as....sm
Obama's and it seems to be working just fine.
He's changed his plan but yet again..
The McCain-Palin campaign has critized his tax plans as welfare, so Barack’s campaign has come back and tweaked it to add a work requirement. (They will materialize things out of thin air as needed to get elected.) This comes from the New Hampshire Union Leader in reply.
Obama Tax Plan
I haven't been here for a while, and if this has already been posted below somewhere, I apologize for duplicating it.
The following link will take you to a site that will show you how much money Barack Obama will save you on taxes, compared to John McCain. (Remember, McCain will be taxing your health insurance benefits for the first time in American history.) Depending on your income, there is quite a difference between the two plans.
http://alchemytoday.com/obamataxcut/
Obama tax plan
McCain may be taxing us, but he is anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage
|
