Pro-choice means...
Posted By: Just the big bad on 2008-11-11
In Reply to: So are you saying that all women should be pro-choice or - Lu
that women have the right to decide whether or not they would have an abortion. It not only allows women who would prefer an abortion to have one, but also allows those who would choose to have the baby just that.....a choice. Regardless of what your choice might be and regardless of why you made that decision, you do have the right to make that choice. That's called not forcing your beliefs on others. I find it offensive that abortion is even an issue for government at all. When was the last time someone questioned whether or not a man should be a father? We aren't cattle where someone has to make the decision of whether or not to thin the herd, we're people!
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pro choice - what it means
you can call it what you want, pro choice usually means you take away a life.
I don't feel the need to make the choice. It's a child, not a choice. n/t
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I think you know what she means...nm
Oh, by all means, it is I who thank you.
''
This means nothing to me
I have seen this and it has been debated as naseum.
As far as winning in Iraq, I am not sure what we are supposed to win.
And please, don't EVER call me your DEAR again. Keep your patronizing on our own board.
Thank you.
It means nothing to you. sm
Yes, by all means, save your anger for being called dear when there it is posted in black and white what the antiwar movement did to our soldiers in Vietnam. Lord love a duck, but I have seen it all now.
Oh, I know what it means....
It is just an uneducated, goofy thing to say...that's all. And you should apologize to all those "grandmas" on this site who you just offended. You are so negative! 
Thanks - that means a lot
Was wondering if anyone would comment. I always question what the government feeds us, but I truly never have in my entire life ever heard our enemies say they hate us because we are free. I always think - how absurd. They just want us to leave them along and stop imposing our viewpoints on them. Thanks again.
I did not know what this means
I'm not sure if you're implying this is a good thing or not and because I didn't know what it means I looked it up. I'll write what I found out and then you can tell me if you think its a good thing or not.
Black theology refers to a variety of Christian theologies which has at its base in the liberation of the marginalized, especially the injustice done towards blacks in American and South African contexts. Black theology mixes liberation theology and the work of Paulo Freire with the civil rights and black power movements.
I had to keep researching certain terms in this because it was still confusing, so I looked up liberation theology and it states that liberation theology is a school of theology within Christianity, particularly in the Roman Catholic Church. Two of the starting points of Liberation theology are first, the question of the original sin, and second, the idea that Christians should make good use of the talents given by God, and that includes intelligence in a general sense, and in particular science.
I then looked up who Paulo Freire is and it says he was a brazilian educator and influential theorist of education. He became familiar with poverty and hunger during the 1929 depression and these experiences shaped his concerns for the poor and would help to construct his particular educational viewpoint.
There's way to much information on both these topics to write here, but to me it sounds like another positive for the Obama's Trinity Unity Church.
Sure you can. :) Means I am doing something right. lol. nm
nm
It means something to me. Obviously not to you....
stop reading my posts if they aggravate you so much. It is a free country. No one is forcing your little mouse to click but you.
Well, that certainly means you are NOT
me his character. Show me one close friend in his past without a shady background, one he does not have to defend. Everyone who has touched his life and made any sort of impression on him has warped his character. Yet, no one who is enamored with him seems to care. They do not care that he stands for nothing, they cannot tell you what his plans for this country are or how he is going to accomplish them. And, they certainly do not want to listen to anything from his past.
Ah, that means you definitely know one or more
xx
maybe she means
congress???
no it means
that I don't wish to spend the time to indulge you
By all means...............sm
let me get that door for you.
It means......
Why didn't you run for election, YOU MIGHT HAVE BECOME THE NEXT PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, BECAUSE YOU SEEM TO BE ABLE TO EVEN TELL THE 44TH PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, BARACK OBAMA, WHAT TO DO.
I guess that when it comes to foreign policy you are in the la-la-land.
It means I won't lie....
But because "several in your town" exist, presumably, that doesn't make you an expert except for maybe in your own grandiose dreams.
Oh, by all means...
Let's jump on this bandwagon instead of discussing the train wreck that IS in the White House.
And, to be honest, this post does NOT deserve to be on the political board. It has nothing to do with politics, just the sore winner Dems continuing to skewer the loser. Palin LOST, people. Let it go.
What she means to say....(sm)
is that I am one of a handful of liberals left on this board. Most everyone else is a republican, so therefore anything I say on here is typically not understood, taken out of context, or simply replied to in terms of character assassination, like the post that I'm responding to now. Just look down the board and you'll see what I'm talking about.
Choice
The three posters chose not to post anymore. No one ran them off.
Pro-Choice
I am pro-choice and here is why. My dad was a big city cop before Roe v. Wade. He told me true stories of woman dying from botched illegal abortions. Many times, they found women who had bled to death because they tried to abort the babies themselves with coat hangers. Other times, they found women dead from sepsis. This was in the days before ambulances when the cops answered all the medical calls.
He was anti-abortion but seeing all these dead young woman haunted him. He saw a lot of awful, gruesome stuff where he worked and eventually became somewhat hardened to it, but these cases he could never forget.
I am not pro-abortion but it is going to happen. It can either be legal and somewhat safe, or illegal and dangerous.
my choice
would be change with demonstrated ability to appreciate the complexity of situations and the willingness to listen to all views on the subject. precisely why I am an ardent Obama supporter.
Again, for those of you who are pro-choice...
and against hunting, fishing, etc, could you please explain the difference between killing something for food or because it is a menace to livestock as opposed to killing a child because it's not the right time for a baby, oops I got pregnant by "accident", oops I don't want children, etc. Again, it is rather ironic that one can be selective in their definition of killing.
whose choice?
seriously, where do you draw the line? i mean a 2-year-old is not old enough to make a "choice" of life or death, so you think it's okay to rid of them too?
choice
I do not think there is a person on here who is in favor of 3rd trimester abortion, etc. The thing is folks, that if abortion is abolished, it not only effects those who haven't learned of birth control use (and I don't feel sorry for them) but those in real need such as rape victims, maternal distress, etc. That is the trouble here, you can't do away with abortions entirely, though a lot of people have abused it. We don't need women resorting to butchers as they did in the past. Look, if someone is wanting one, they are going to have it, legal or not. We have to make it the same as any other medical procedure in this country.. you see your doctor, you make arrangements for the procedure to be done in the hospital through a referral.
what choice
When Obama wins, the repubs will no choice but to accept that fact. I cant wait to get out of the Bush admin and have a change. The last eight years has sunk our country.
There is another choice.....sm
for president. Check out Chuck Baldwin and the Constitutional Party. Warning: He is VERY conservative, so all you liberals need not look. ;o)
http://www.baldwin08.com/
Actually under O you will have no choice
The dems are talking about a draft. O has already starting talking about it being a requirment for college students. Yes REQUIRE, not option.
http://kokonutpundits.blogspot.com/2008/11/obamas-new-youth-corp-requirement.html
Going to war is your choice...not ours.
Those who choose to elect war-mongers should be the ones sent to battle. Those who choose to elect peace-loving Presidents should not be forced to serve. That is why there are conscientious objectors.
I think you summed it up when you described the lack of intelligence involved in being the first to enlist.
I don't think we will have any choice. (sm)
As you said, people will do whatever they have to feed thier families. I also think before it's over with, we'll have to get a board for gardening on this site...LOL.
Bad choice, but he had to do it (sm)
IMHO, Obama made a deal with the Clintons in order to get elected and now it's pay up time. Look at all the Clintonites he's got surrounding him - the positions have changed, but all the faces are the same. All we need is Madeline Albright in there somewhere.
It is my choice, and I don't believe it.
Scare tactics are a dime a dozen in religion.
No, I think the choice was hers...(sm)
but that's the point. She had the choice of either having the baby or not, as opposed to being forced into having the baby, which is exactly what outlawing abortion would do.
What exactly do you think Pro Choice is?
Pro Choice means you believe a woman has the right to decide what to do with her body - exactly how do you figure Obama is not Pro Choice?
And he is not saying that women are going to be required to abort their unborn - he is saying they are going to have the right!
That's your choice
and God gives you that right.
Christianity is very much based on fact just as it is on faith. The faith comes from having faith that Jesus' death was sufficient for all. The facts have been shown through archeology and even science.
If the Bible was scrutinized the way other ancient literature has been, it would be found to be true and consistent within itself, but because there is preconceived notions held by those who scrutinize, such as the "fact" that miracles cannot happen, it is believed to be incorrect, myth if you will.
I used to be just like you. I used to think that Christians were rude Bible-thumping bigots who tried to take the corner on Heaven. But when I finally dropped my bias and read the Bible as I would any other book and once I let people actually speak their peace to me, I came to the logical conclusion that Jesus was real, He was the Godman, and He was the Lord. Reading the Bible through you cannot help but notice the consistency and fluidness that runs through it. The OT is the story of the promise God made, and the NT is God fulfilling that promise.
I was not raised in a church, I was not taught about Jesus by my parents. I was not forced to go to Sunday School and I was not forced to be baptized. I made a decision. A decision has to be made with your mind, your emotion and your spirit. It's a three part deal. Many people make emotional decisions and once the emotion is gone, so is the decision. Many people make logical decisions, but the decision is never personal for them, so neither is the relationship with God. Many times the spirit tries to guide someone to the decision, but the person feels logically or emotionally that they cannot.
I may come off as brash because I don't take the "we are all on the same path route" as some do. I would be wrong in doing so, and I would be denying what my Lord explicitly said. To do so would have serious repercussions for me. Therefore, I choose to do what He says and have people not like me, rather than do what people would have me do and deny the One who died for me.
And that is your choice
You choose that belief; I don't. If you want to lead a life ruled entirely by Biblical law, maybe you could all band together and buy an island or something and call it Christganistan. This is a secular country, founded to get away from the idea that there is one true way to live one's life.
The more the so-called tolerant Christians write here, the less difference I see between Radical Islam and Fundamental Christian. It's two sides of the same coin, and it saddens me that this country, founded on principles of individual choice, has seemingly regressed in that regard.
It is NOT a choice.
You keep on with this ridiculous choice bit, but homosexuality is not a choice anymore than being blond or tall or having blue eyes is a choice. It is what the individual is born as.
Sure it's a choice.
God says it is. I believe Him not you. Sorry...
thank you and I like #2 choice. nm..
x
russell means
Russell Means Visits Camp Casey II
Means Says He Understands Power Of Women
By Gene Ellis
ICONOCLAST REPORTER
CAMP CASEY II — Russell Means’ appearance on the stage at Camp Casey II in Crawford yesterday was a surprise to many. For background on this famous Indian (who eschews the government term “Native American”), see brief additional biographical information at the end of this story.
Means, a long-time activist, arrived in Central Texas to support the efforts of Cindy Sheehan and her Iraq war protestors. He well understands the power of women. He spoke, both on stage and in a later interview with the Iconoclast, of the matriarchal society of the American Indian.
Motherhood in America has an inkling of the meaning of this, Means mused, but the Indians live it.
He explained that in a family, the mother is the only member who cannot be replaced. Women live longer than men, can stand more pain, have more endurance, he said. At about this point, Means introduced his wife, Pearl, and received a hug from Joan Baez, who was sitting on the floor of the stage with Cindy Sheehan, listening to Means’ remarks.
Means said that America has a patriarchal society where men rule alone and in fear of the unknown because they are alone. Matriarchy, he pointed out, is not fear-based. In a matriarchal society, each sex is celebrated for its strengths, and there is local control, male/female balance.
During the later interview with the Iconoclast, Means made a point of saying that he is sincere about women taking control of their power, providing a balanced and positive culture. The Blue and Gold Star mothers have an innate understanding of matriarchy, according to Means, even though, as members of a patriarchal society, they have been brainwashed for many years.
In a matriarchal society, all must be responsible.
“If the government of this country imposes so many rules, we feel no responsibility for ourselves, and we become careless,” said Means. To illustrate his point, he used the example of the lack of traffic rules in Italy. Because there are no rules, each person must take it upon his or herself to be responsible, not to be careless, to ensure his or her own safety.
When asked to speak about military recruiters targeting low-income youths, including Indians, Means said that it follows the history of a patriarchal society that the poor kids are to be the common fodder. Even after the Civil War, when Americans wouldn’t join the military, European immigrants were pulled off boats and forced to do two years of subscripted service to obtain citizenship. The poor are always a target for military induction, Means concluded.
Means reiterated that if men rule alone in their citadels of power, they are fearful.
A libertarian, Means paraphrased George Washington, “Government is force, nothing more, nothing less.”
Means added to this his own thoughts, “This government is evil. How can patriots support a president over the Constitution? That is treason. The purpose of the first amendment is to encourage dissent. Without dissent, it is impossible to live free.”
His comments were reminiscent of Margaret Mead’s quote that has graced the back of many a tee shirt in Crawford over the last two weeks. It reads, “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.”
The Los Angeles Times has described Russell Means as the most famous American Indian since Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse.
Means is a life-long indigenous rights/constitutional rights activist, actor, artist, and author. His best selling autobiography “Where White Men Fear to Tread” is currently on its eighth printing. He has a doctorate in Indian Studies, and is also a practicing attorney on the Sioux Indian Reservation in South Dakota.
For more than 30 years, Means has remained active with the American Indian Movement and has traveled and lectured extensively throughout the world while working for over 12 years with the United Nations.
Means became the first national director of The American Indian Movement (AIM). He is known for helping lead his people to stand against the United States government at the Siege of Wounded Knee in 1973.
His vision is for indigenous people to be free — free to be human, free to travel, free to shop, free to trade where they choose, free to choose their own teachers — free to follow the religion of their fathers, free to talk, think and act for themselves, and then, says Means, they will obey every law or submit to the penalty.
About The Siege at Wounded Knee, he wrote, “Our aim at Wounded Knee was to force the U.S. government to live up to its own laws. From that, one can draw the real lesson of our stand there: It is the duty of every responsible American to ensure that their government upholds the spirit and the laws of the United States Constitution. After all, what freedom really means is that you are free to be responsible.”
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RUSSELL MEANS (right) gets a hug from singer Joan Baez at Camp Casey II on Saturday.
— Iconoclast Photo By Gene Ellis
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Home
Copyright © 2005 The Lone Star Iconoclast |
Please enlighten me as to what it means.
Considering we will never leave Iraq if Bush plans on placing a permanent military base there.
Actually no, that isn't what Neocon means at all. sm
And I wasn't the one who wrote the things you are responding to, but here is a really good definition of Neocon and perhaps you can see why AG and I and others have stridently objected to being labeled Neocon in the past. Though I have some Neocon friends and I admire most of their beliefs, I am no Neocon. Neither, for that matter, is President Bush, who has been labeled a neocon ad nauseum on these boards.
From Chris Jones:
It would appear that you are unfamiliar with the history of the neo-conservative movement, a history which explains why some folks associate it with Jews and why the use of “neo-con” as a pejorative seems to some to smell of anti-Semitism.
The original “neo-conservatives” were a group of left-of-center intellectuals who became disillusioned with their liberal politics and became conservatives — mostly, but not exclusively, on foreign policy and national security issues. Many, but not all, of these intellectuals were Jewish, and the “center of gravity” of the nascent neo-conservative movement was Commentary magazine and its editors and writers. Prominent among the early neo-conservatives were Irving Kristol and Norman Podhoretz (who are Jewish) and Jeanne Kirkpatrick (who is (I think) a Gentile). Commentary magazine played the role in the neo-conservative movement that was played by National Review in the broader conservative intellectual movement of the 1960s and 1970s.
The contemporary conservative journalists Bill Kristol and John Podhoretz are the sons of the early neo-conservatives Irving Kristol and Norman Podhoretz.
The defining characteristic of neo-conservatism, properly so called, is a belief in a robustly activist foreign policy by people who were formerly left-of-center. The movement is associated with Jewish-ness because many of its early leading lights happened to be Jews; but Jewish-ness is accidental to the movement, not characteristic of it. To use “neo-con” as a sort of vaguely anti-Semitic slur is not only dishonorable, but a misuse of language. That doesn’t mean that it doesn’t happen, though.
Regardless, this means we kill them all?
It is their right to live the way they chose. We can't go attacking every one who is a possible threat on more levels than I'm going to go into here. I would rather see our leaders spend the time and money on securing things here rather than wage war there. We are just formulating more hatred. We CAN change whether we are the ones in the war by not going to war, and I shall not blindly trust our leaders to do the right thing because it has been proven time and again that they rarely do.
UM BEFORE YOU KNOW YOUR PREGNANT MEANS...
before you've missed a period! you totally contradicted yourself. i never said at the instant of sex you're pregnant. I said the heart is beating before "MOST" women know they are pregnant, and you JUST VALIDATED MY POINT!!! even going as far as to say they are developing at week 4! (which is when women miss their periods) you do know how this works don't you?
Never noticed that before. Not that it means anything of course.....
but it IS freaky. lol.
By all means....don't view it. You might actually have to really know...
what you support. Can't have that, can you?
Of course not. It just means she doesn't use it herself.
nm
Obviously means there is no documentation....
other than dailykos or huffpost (good book of the left).
Basically what that means is (sm)
that the Dems have a majority so the Repubs can fillibuster all they want to, but when it comes to the final vote, if every Dem votes yes and every Repub votes no, the yes vote goes through because there would be more yes votes. It's just that there are more Dems than Repubs - they have the majority vote, just not enough to stop a fillibuster.
What 'change' means to me:
1) A government that works FOR and WITH American citizens, not AGAINST them.
2) At least an ATTEMPT to balance the budget. With all this country has to offer, we should be coming out AHEAD each year, not borrowing money.
3) Elected officials doing what they were elected to do, not lining their own pockets at the expense of the country's CITIZENS.
4) American workers being valued enough to be offered jobs with a good living wage and benefits package, and incentives for performance. NOT forcing everyone to be part-time/OC/or to work for pennies on the dollars their work is really worth.
5) In this country business has the freedom to begin, and if lucky, to grow from small to big, to HUGE. That good fortune should come with more responsibility. Part of the reason they're so successful is that they're in America. Part of the rewards of that success should in turn go into improving the infrastructure of the towns, states, and country, and more importantly, the WORKERS who make it possible for them to do business at all.
6) Somewhere along the line, this country has forgotten that our constitutional right to 'freedom of religion' ALSO means 'freedom FROM religion', for those of us who don't want it continually shoved down our throats. And it most definitely does NOT belong in the government. It belongs in the hearts & homes of its believers, and in church. NOT in the White House.
7) Change means not selling this country lock, stock and barrel to every country with lots of money to spend. It means not selling your soul or stomping & squashing the 'little guy' for the almighty buck.
8) Change means bringing some hope back to America again. Right now, and for the past 8 years, I personally have had no hope. I've watched my wages shrivel, as the expectations of how much work Im expected to produce per hour continues to go up. I've watched my rent grow, and the square footage of the apartments/studios I've rented go down and down. I've watched my car grow old before its time because I have no money to take care of it. I've had to do without seeing family members because there's nothing left over at the end of each month to afford to travel even a couple hundred miles. I have NO hope of ever seeing my family in Europe again. Unless there's a huge turnaround in the country & our economy, my flying days are OVER.
9) Change means taking care of our soldiers. If you're going to send them into harm's way, as we've done with so many these past years, then by golly, TAKE CARE OF THEM when they come home again. American soldiers should be:
a) Paid what they're worth, so their families don't starve while they're serving.
b) Not be lied to about when their tours of duty end.
c) They should be sent to war with the FINEST of equipment, not decrepit old stuff that's breaking down and risking their lives. And the fact that some have no bullet-proof vests, and their family ends up having to supply one for them, is a national disgrace. They should have the best of everything, not the worst.
d) When they're injured, they should get the BEST medical care, not what they're currently getting. Their benefits should take care of them and their families comfortably, not leave them in poverty.
10) And finally, change means taking care of our SENIOR CITIZENS. Most have worked hard all their lives, and too many are living in poverty. We boomers are in for a shock, 'cause lots of us will NEVER retire. We'll be working 2 jobs to make ends meet because our SS (IF we even get any) won't even pay for our gas each month. If we are going to be more and more resonsible for our own retirement, then we should be paid a wage that actually allows us to fund our IRA's each month, and not watch them languish, ignored & unfunded, as I've been doing for the last 10 years because my job now only pays enough to keep a roof over my head TODAY. But TOMORROW? The way things have been going the last 8 years, I find it harder and harder to even believe there will BE a tomorrow. When this place gets too expensive to rent, the next roof over my head will most likely be my CAR.
So the biggest CHANGE I'd like to see in this country is an administration that sees the big picture, sees how REAL Americans have to scrape by, and not just how things are up on Capitol Hill.
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