Maybe we should put that patriot act to good use....(sm)
Posted By: Just the big bad on 2009-04-08
In Reply to:
like on the nuts at Fox News who are doing nothing but inciting violence.
http://leesearles.wordpress.com/2009/04/07/rightwingnuttery-glenn-beck-and-the-rise-of-fox-news-militia-media-edition/
Complete Discussion Below:  marks the location of current message within thread
The messages you are viewing
are archived/old.
To view latest messages and participate in discussions, select
the boards given in left menu
Other related messages found in our database
Add to that the Patriot Act..
They could not get the Patriot Act passed before 9/11. Read this Act. It is downright scary and at the very end it states "or other purposes." What "other purposes?"
yes. Patriot. nm
nm
Don't want a patriot, need someone
who is highly intelligent, who takes time to think through his/her decisions, not a shoot off the hip kind of guy.
what does this have to do with the patriot act?
nm
Now here's a patriot...Not..(sm)
Rush Limbaugh: *I Hope Obama Fails." Somebody's gotta say it.*
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_011609/content/01125113.guest.html
Sheehan, a true patriot
I have followed this courageous woman who sacrified her son for this war and I have nothing but praise and respect for her. She is a true American.
Michael Moore a patriot? sm
in WHAT alternate universe? Investigate? He wouldn't know a true investigation if it bit him on his very large butt. During the last election when he called Americans in general and Democrats in particular stupid...well I guess he loves the country but holds the people in contempt...particularly liberals as that is what he said...a patriot? Well the founding fathers would spin in their graves on that one. LOL...omg. Michael Moore a patriot. LOL.
He was a true patriot! I'll bet you are
proud of him.
I didn't vote for or against the Patriot Act and neither did you....
Congress did. Obama voted to reauthorize it as well.
The Patriot Act has nothing whatsoever to do with communism. What would make you say that?
Patriot Act/health care
You mean HC, of course. She was not different than any other congress and senate members. Patriot Act parts 1 and 2 were passed BEFORE the Iraq War WMD Bush lies, people die justification based on faulty intelligence was revealed. It makes me crazy that it is still there and I truly hope to see it revised or scrapped sometime in the next 4 years.
I am asking you, seriously...do you know when you started feeling vulnerable to govt control? I feel that too, but I am sure for different reasons than you...and I really am interested to know what make you feel that way.
Obama's plan is not a socialist plan like the ones you are referring to. He is not taking free enterprise out of health care. He is proposing to open up the existing plan that now covers Congress, the senate and federal employees. I have looked at that plan. It offers a number of choices in terms of deductible amounts, types of coverage (HMO, PPO, etc), premium amounts and the like. Pre-existing conditions are covered under some of those plans, if not all of them. He is aiming his pre-existing changes toward private insurance companies as part of his health plan.
It works like any other group plan. If you broaden the base of employees (in this case, citizens added to the plan by CHOICE, not force), the premiums come down. The care remains the same. You are free to choose the plan that best suits your needs or elect to keep your existing insurance. For Obama, it is a question of giving people access to affordable health care. He is not suggesting to transfer tax dollars to create the kind of plan you are describing that you consider to be subpar.
What is TriCare? I have to leave for a little while, but when I get back I will try to retrieve the link I used to inspect the existing federal plan and if I find it, I will post it later this afternoon. BTW, I know I come on strong and use sarcasm to a fault when I feel I am dealing with a poster who I think (sometimes mistakenly) is either ill informed or showing disrespect...not when having healthy debates over differences in opinion, beliefs or ideology. Those debates end up being the most informative of all and are a lot more satisfying than just preaching to the choir.
Do you recall the pre-Patriot Act world?
when diverse viewpoints were at our fingertips and not dictated by Mega-Media outlets riding around in the pockets of political status quo? Not only has this dummed down American audiences nationwide, but it has been a direct assault on the democratic process.
Patriot Act provisions:
1. Law enforcement agencies authorized (and sometimes forced) to search telephone, e-mail communications, medical, financial and other records without a warrant. This has been exercised against their own citizens, the most recent instance being voyeuristic easedropping on intimate conversations between American troops serving in Iraw and their spouses...right to privacy in 1st, 4th and 5th admendments notwithstanding.
2. Eased restrictions on foreign intelligence gathering within the United States. This has allowed them to expand their definition of terrorisim to include individuals and groups exercising their 1st amendment right to redress the government via political dissent.
3. Expanded the Secretary of the Treasury's authority to regulate financial transactions, particularly those involving foreign individuals and entities. An example of this would be freezing funds of a first generation natural born citizens sending money to their family members who still live overseas.
4. Enhances the discretion of law enforcement and immigration authorities in detaining and deporting SUSPECTED (not proven) of terrorism-related acts. This has not worked out well for many perfectly innocent citizens and permanent residents whose only crime is to have a Moslem name.
5. The act also expands the definition of terrorism to include domestic terrorism, thus enlarging the number of activities to which the USA Patriot Act’s expanded law enforcement powers can be applied.
Abuse of the Patriot Act has been rife and is the stuff of legend, as is the controversy that surrounds it. The erosion of civil right stemming from this one piece of legislation is breath-taking, but the mindset that created it....even more so. I will be voting for a candidate that shows at least some sort of awareness of civil rights. Those are the freedoms I worry about.
Huckabee forgot about the Patriot Act...
Ummm audacious? More control? I'm getting whiplash from looking behind in order to look ahead.
I guess our definitions of a Patriot differs
and I guess that's okay, but the truth will come out in the wash, eventually. All the media filters in the world will not keep the truth coming from coming out eventually, and we may all be surprised at what the truth actually is which may be drastically different than either one of our points of view.
Bush to criminalize his protesters under Patriot Act
By Patriot Daily
News Clearinghouse
1-13-6
George Bush wants to create the new criminal of disruptor who can be jailed for the crime of disruptive behavior. A little-noticed provision in the latest version of the Patriot Act will empower Secret Service to charge protesters with a new crime of disrupting major events including political conventions and the Olympics.
The Secret Service would also be empowered to charge persons with breaching security and to charge for entering a restricted area which is where the President or other person protected by the Secret Service is or will be temporarily visiting. In short, be sure to stay in those wired, fenced containments or free speech zones.
Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse's diary:
Who is the disruptor? Bush Team history tells us the disruptor is an American citizen with the audacity to attend Bush events wearing a T-shirt that criticizes Bush; or a member of civil rights, environmental, anti-war or counter-recruiting groups who protest Bush policies; or a person who invades Bush's bubble by criticizing his policies. A disruptor is also a person who interferes in someone else's activity, such as interrupting Bush when he is speaking at a press conference or during an interview.
What are the parameters of the crime of disruptive behavior? The dictionary defines disruptive as characterized by unrest or disorder or insubordination. The American Medical Association defines disruptive behavior as a style of interaction with people that interferes with patient care, and can include behavior such as foul language; rude, loud or offensive comments; and intimidation of patients and family members.
What are the rules of engagement for disruptors? Some Bush Team history of their treatment of disruptors provide some clues on how this administration will treat disruptors in the future.
(1) People perceived as disruptors may be preemptively ejected from events before engaging in any disruptive conduct.
In the beginning of this war against disruptors, Americans were ejected from taxpayer funded events where Bush was speaking. At first the events were campaign rallies during the election, and then the disruptor ejectment policy was expanded to include Bush's post election campaign-style events on public policy issues on his agenda, such as informing the public on medicare reform and the like. If people drove to the event in a car with a bumper sticker that criticized Bush's policies or wore T-shirts with similar criticism, they were disruptors who could be ejected from the taxpayer event even before they engaged in any disruptive behavior. White House press secretary McClellan defended such ejectments as a proper preemptive strike against persons who may disrupt an event: If we think people are coming to the event to disrupt it, obviously, they're going to be asked to leave.
(2) Bush Team may check its vast array of databanks to cull out those persons who it deems having disruptor potential and then blacklist those persons from events.
The White House even has a list of persons it deems could be disruptive to an eventand then blacklists those persons from attending taxpayer funded events where Bush speaks. Sounds like Bush not only has the power to unilaterally designate people as enemy combatants in the global war on terror, but to unilaterally designate Americans as disruptive in the domestic war against free speech.
(3) The use of surveillance, monitoring and legal actions against disruptors.
Bush's war against disruptors was then elevated to surveillance, monitoring, and legal actions against disruptor organizations. The FBI conducts political surveillance and obtains intelligence filed in its database on Bush administration critics , such as civil rights groups (e.g., ACLU), antiwar protest groups (e.g., United for Peace and Justice) and environmental groups (e.g., Greenpeace).
This surveillance of American citizens exercising their constitutional rights has been done under the pretext of counterterrorism activities surrounding protests of the Iraq war and the Republican National Convention. The FBI maintains it does not have the intent to monitor political activities and that its surveillance and intelligence gathering is intended to prevent disruptive and criminal activity at demonstrations, not to quell free speech.
Surveillance of potential disruptors then graduated to legal actions as a preemptive strike against potential disruptive behavior at public events. In addition to monitoring and surveillance of legal groups and legal activities, the FBI issued subpoenas for members to appear before grand juries based on the FBI's intent to prevent disruptive convention protests. The Justice Dept. opened a criminal investigation and subpoenaed records of Internet messages posted by Bush`s critics. And, the Justice Dept. even indicted Greenpeace for a protest that was so lame the federal judge threw out the case.
So now the Patriot Act, which was argued before enactment as a measure to fight foreign terrorists, is being amended to make clear that it also applies to American citizens who have the audacity to disrupt President Bush wherever his bubble may travel. If this provision is enacted into law, then Bush will have a law upon which to expand the type of people who constitute disruptors and the type of activities that constitute disruptive activities. And, then throw them all in jail.
Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse
Obama voted to extend the Patriot Act...
just so you know. After he said he would work to repeal it. There's some honesty for ya. Frankly, I don't think throwing your pastor and mentor of 20 years under the bus for your political career is particularly moral either. But that is just me.
This should make **patriot** Cheney happy.
NM
The Patriot Act is up but some want to keep it, including Schumer. Don't blame Bush for that. nm
Please give examples of people violated by the Patriot Act
like rr said, Nancy Pelosi said she knows of no one who has been abused by the Patriot Act.
We lost our freedom with the last admin. - wire tapping, Patriot Act, etc....nm
x
That's true - and Barack Obama is a true Patriot too.
Again we can agree to disagree. How John McCain has voted goes against everything I want as a President, but there are an equal number of people to me who feel opposite. That's the way it goes.
Your last comment brought to mind how true that is. Being a true patriot is not harmful in a candidate. John McCain is a patriot. So is Barack Obama.
Good post....truth doesn't always sound good
@
Good for you! Most people would not recognize good...sm
character if it hit them over the head, just sheep who follow along without thinking for themselves, believing the political pundit spitting out garbage.
Good post - good research (sm)
History does repeat itself at times. I had forgotten about the 50s and Russia.
Very scary times we live in and so many new enemies. This is definitely not a scare tactic but a very clear warning. You can't ignore facts, they are there.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
rasberries
Good point, good post. Thanks.
Good One!!!
 especially since I have four cats and no dogs....I did have a pit bull once, but he was the sweetest thing and rather lick you to death than bite!!!
Good
Great, we have something in common. *BIG HUG*. Bye, Brunson.
Well, good, cuz I am not following you at all. SM
An analogy was made and you are making it sound like a Bible verse? Please. Give it up.
LOL! That's a good one.
Contact the administrator so that you can give her more than just your ISP to use against you. Why not give her your email, so she can report back to your employer with your name, too?
Thanks, good to see
a fair sampling of papers. There are so few independent papers anymore; and they all put out the same spin due to being owned by the The Powers That Be, it is good to hear people speaking out again but my God, what it took to have that happen.
LOL! Good one!
I can't stop laughing at the row v wade line!
As far as everything else you said, I couldn't agree more. Thank you for posting your honest feelings. It helps a lot to know that all those who are born again aren't of the radical mindset that is usually shown on these boards. 
good vs bad
That is the trouble with radical right wingers..they think the world is evil or good..black or white..you are either with us or not..axis of evil..LOL..simple thinking for complicated times, if you ask me..
Good ones...sm
Especially staying the course, 911 and ownership society.
These are good :) nm
Good ones..nm
This is another good one.
This is about the power of dissent and the duty of the TRUE PATRIOT to exercise it.
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0704-21.htm
Good for him...sm
(off topic: A 17-year old deputy. That's kinda young for the job I would think.)
Booze does amplify the personality. You do and say things that you would not have if you weren't 'under the influence.' I can't overlook the fact that Mel's father says the the Holocaust did not happen, and is fiction. The same father who moved his family to Australia so that his older brothers would not have to go to Vietnam mind you. What's that saying about apples?
I've learned to separated the man from the movies. Passion of the Christ, I loved.
Pol Pot...not a good example. sm
Pol Pot would have never been allowed his free reign had we stayed the course in Vietnam. The left got their wish. We withdrawn. Millions died. But the left never talks about that.
As far as *we* killing blacks and American Indians. I never killed anyone. Africans were caught and sold by their own people to the slave traders. We can sit and assign guilt until now to kingdom come. To read posts like this further illustrates the people in this country who think of the U.S. as the great Satan.
This is very good to know.
This seems to diametrically oppose what Marylandgal is saying, too.
Good for you and good for him!
I think he is going to go a long way and I think he would make a very deliberate and thoughtful president that could just lead us out of this quagmire the country is currently in, and I think he has the better national healthcare proposition on the table. I hope he maximizes on his momentum. New Hampshire may not be so quick to endorse though.
Well seeing as none are very good...
I think that because none of them are the perfect choice, I want a good speaker to represent us. I'm not in love with Obama, some of what he does is a little unnerving. What Hillary is about just downright scares the you know what out of me (as does McCain - that relic should be in some sanitarium somewhere) - how he made it I don't know because I believe there were a lot of other more qualified candidates on the repubs side. Anyway...seeing as none of them is the "ideal" candidate I at least want someone in who is a good speaker and who can represent our country in a dignified and intelligent manner. Hillary does not. I've listened to her speeches with an open mind hoping (I mean really really hoping) that I would feel differently about her because there was a possibility she could be chosen. But every time she speaks it just brings my hopes down. Her thoughts are not together. She cannot read without constantly looking at her notes, and most of what I hear is "women, women, women. We've been done wrong to and now its payback time. We're going to make them pay for what they did to us, etc, etc (of course not in those exact words - but that is the implication of her speeches). I've not once heard her give a speech of hope and promise. What she does say is more of the same retoric. More of "I'm going to give you this or that - which is what they promised when Bill was campaigning years ago, but never filled their promises back then. That is why I do not believe any of what she says. False hopes.
So yes....candidates are not all that great, but I want a great speaker to talk to other countries and not make us look like fools which is what George Bush & Bill Clinton did when they were in. I also want our leader to talk to our allies AND enemies. Everyone needs to live together in peace and if there is a slight chance that Obama can do it I'm for it. This whole idea that Clinton and McCain will "threaten" other countries with "obliteration". Well how would they feel if our enemies said do what we want or we're going to "obliterate" you. So yes, I'm for someone who is a good speaker and good negotiator.
That is all well and good, but....
I still don't agree. I hear "most Muslims don't agree with," but you never hear the Muslims themselves saying so. Why don't they? Why don't they write articles, get published, come out publically against extremism? Now I know that there are Muslims who are not prone to violence and yes, they abhor it...but a personal feeling means nothing if those who feel that way don't unite and make themselves known. Of course Muslim countries denounced the attack...what would YOU do if you thought you might come into the crosshairs of the US military? Who knows what they were saying to their own people. I seem to remember footage of your regular Muslim folks dancing in the streets over there and saying we got what we deserved. They were not members of AL Qaeda, just everyday Muslim citizens. So...sorry....I don't think this gentleman gets it and I don't think Obama gets it either.
There will always be fundamentalists, and I believe more Muslims than not are fundamentalists; just will not say so, and just a few of them can do great damage and frankly, I want a President in the White House that I think those people will have a grudging respect for; I want them to think he/she will train down misery on them if they attack us again. Because, frankly, that is all they understand, and for all Bush's failures (and he has many in my books, including spending like there was no tomorrow), I believe that is one thing he HAS done and the way he reacted to 9-11 is exactly what has kept them from attacking us like that again. They don't want American boots on the ground in anymore Muslim countries. Because Bush gets it. He knows who and what he is fighting.
Just as an aside....what makes you think Obama is in favor of free trade? His votes in Congress and many of his statements are in direct contradiction to that...? I have read up on it, and while he has made statements that he is "for" free trade, all his actions speak otherwise.
Bottom line...I don't trust him, I don't think he understands Muslim extremism, and I know he is way further to the left and has rampant socialist tendencies that I don't agree with...and if he is elected, look for taxes to go up no matter what he says, because to do everything he wants to do is going to cost a lot of money. And when he starts with the taxing the "rich" and people start to jump on that bandwagon...they need to look at the income thresholds for those "rich" and realize that it will hurt the small businesses who employ a great many people in this country. If he does that, look for more jobs and companies to go offshore. A major contributor to offshoring is companies trying to get out from under the huge tax burden Democratic congresses have put on them.
As a side note...violence associated with the Muslim religion is not new...their rampage across Europe killing Christians on the way to trying to take over Jerusalem...that was many hundreds of years ago, leading to the crusades. Muslim extremists (although they were all pretty extreme in those days) were about world domination then and they are about it now...they are just more clever in how they seek to bring it about.
And look at Sharia law...how much more violent can you get? Stonings, cutting off limbs, honor killings...sorry...I don't think they get it at all...just my opinion. If you put in Sharia law in this country we would have a gazillion stonings a day and a good portion of the populace would be limbless...if even alive. And there are American citizens (though Muslim) who have participated in and fully condoned honor killings...sooo I don't think it is wise to assume that free markets and capitalism will change minds and hearts. Nice thought...just not a realistic one, in my view. While there ARE those Muslims who are not extreme in how they interpret the Koran...I do not think they are in the majority. Nothing about the world today makes me come anywhere close to believing that.
Both of those men are good men....
I was impressed with Duncan Hunter during the primaries. I really have no idea where McCain is going to go. Another real interesting aspect of this race. I have to say Obama surprised me choosing Biden. Especially when they have Biden saying on tape he would be proud to run with McCain. Now he is going to have to turn around and attack McCain. Slight loss of credibility there. Oh well. Friendships often get thrown under the political bus...on both sides.
good one!
nm
Good. nm
nm
Good one!
.
That was a good one!
Bullseye.
and we could all use a good
laugh -- breaks the tension of the past couple months.
That's a good one!
That Sarah Silverman is ignorant!
Good one... :) (NM)
xx
Good one. nm
.
|
