Looks more like Germany wouldn't give 'em up to the US. nm
Posted By: Democrat on 2005-12-27
In Reply to: Bush releases Hijacker Sought by U.S. - PK
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10%. No deductions. Wouldn't need 'em if
.
Germany is being used. sm
The people bringing these charges are 11 Iraqi and they chose Germany as their *world stage*. They are being helped by some bleeding heart liberal named Michael Ratner.
It may be time for the US to close its military bases in Germany and shift them to Poland and the new East European democracies. They are far better allies and understand the importance of freedom and liberty.
Take it to Germany. They liked 0. ;-) lol
nm
Wow....even Germany and canada want O....
now THERE is an endorsement.
The voting jews? Redneck fundamentalist? Geez...BIGOTED much??
Another graduate of the Saul Alinsky Marxist-socialist (DNC) school of thought. This is ugly, ugly, and yet another wonderful reason to NOT vote for the big O and give this kind of bigotry power.
I think I would prefer Germany,
Austria, Greece, or maybe even Moldova.
Germany didn't kill
The whole fricken country didn't kill jews - the leadership of that country did!!!!! Just like every Muslim is not a terrorist, every person who lives south of Maryland is not a red neck. I don't agree with prosecuting Rumsfeld for Murder, but let's keep the bigotry off the liberal board and take it back over to the conservative board where it is welcome.
Yeah, in Germany they were called....
Gestapo. In Iran they are called...the Republican Guard. If he even STARTS down that road he should be impeached. And who is the "we" that set the national security objectives and what are those objectives???
Would you prefer Obama's arena be less than it was in Germany?
The guy has a great audience and my only fear was he would take on the black agenda when our country if falling apart - There is so much to do.
Yeah, give the man a stage that at least is proportionate to foreign countries' stage given to an American politician. Geesh.
I didn't see crowds gather for anyone else. When a crowd that size gathers for a person, they can have any darn stage set they want. As they deserved it.
In response to the "take it to Germany" post.
Seems that theybarely have a grasp on DC politics, let alone US imperatives abroad and challenges that America faces outside its borders. They scoff at American traditions such as diplomacy, alliance, common interests and initiatives aimed at real solutions for fascist dictatorships, human rights abuse, global poverty and terrorism. BTW, though we may have our own garden of home-grown terrorists, most terrorists live abroad. The ethnocentric jingoism expressed in the "America, love it of leave it/hate it and leave it" crowd and the imperial aspirations of their party in its attempts to disregard cultural differences, bomb nations into democracy and turn countries of the world into pitstops for the Americans to make on their resource raping rampages is exactly the kind of behavior that empowers terrorist worldviews to attract followers, strengthens their resolve and emboldens them to carry out their terrorist acts of war.
We actually DO need to take it to Germany and to all UN/NATO countries, turn a new page on our approaches and come up with new solutions, plans well understood by Obama and brilliantly articulated in his plans for diplomacy and policies on the war on terror. Biden grocs these concepts. Mccain, same old same old. Palin doesn't do foreign policy. The party obvoiusly does not even recognize the need for it.
Germany released him, OUR state department up in arms
and protesting the release...what's the point. It only proves that the U.S. don't want this thugs released...
Why do you think Obama campaigned in Europe/Germany last year? sm
Were they voting for him?
Huge red flag went up for a lot of us on that one.
The writing was on the wall, but so many refused to see it.
You hope it's wrong, and so do I. But only time will tell.
No doubt conservative right-wingers can be found in Germany
So let me get this straight. While there, did you actually founnd more than 250,000 Germans who were PO'ed? You did a quick street survey, right?
A picture is worth 1000 words. Your claim does nothing to change the fact that the turn-out was phenomenal, he brought many in the audience to tears, was perceived as the Black JFK and created a sensation all across Europe. Please note, this is not a US media source.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23520458-details/Obama+addresses+200,000+in+Berlin+as+he+calls+for+%5C'walls+between+Christians,+Muslims+and+Jews+to+come+down%5C'/article.do
Germany seek charges against Rumsfeld for prison abuse sm
Friday, Nov. 10, 2006
Exclusive: Charges Sought Against Rumsfeld Over Prison Abuse
A lawsuit in Germany will seek a criminal prosecution of the outgoing Defense Secretary and other U.S. officials for their alleged role in abuses at Abu Ghraib and Gitmo
By ADAM ZAGORIN
Just days after his resignation, former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is about to face more repercussions for his involvement in the troubled wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. New legal documents, to be filed next week with Germany's top prosecutor, will seek a criminal investigation and prosecution of Rumsfeld, along with Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, former CIA director George Tenet and other senior U.S. civilian and military officers, for their alleged roles in abuses committed at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison and at the U.S. detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
The plaintiffs in the case include 11 Iraqis who were prisoners at Abu Ghraib, as well as Mohammad al-Qahtani, a Saudi held at Guantanamo, whom the U.S. has identified as the so-called 20th hijacker and a would-be participant in the 9/11 hijackings. As TIME first reported in June 2005, Qahtani underwent a special interrogation plan, personally approved by Rumsfeld, which the U.S. says produced valuable intelligence. But to obtain it, according to the log of his interrogation and government reports, Qahtani was subjected to forced nudity, sexual humiliation, religious humiliation, prolonged stress positions, sleep deprivation and other controversial interrogation techniques.
Lawyers for the plaintiffs say that one of the witnesses who will testify on their behalf is former Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinski, the one-time commander of all U.S. military prisons in Iraq. Karpinski — who the lawyers say will be in Germany next week to publicly address her accusations in the case — has issued a written statement to accompany the legal filing, which says, in part: It was clear the knowledge and responsibility [for what happened at Abu Ghraib] goes all the way to the top of the chain of command to the Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld .
A spokesperson for the Pentagon told TIME there would be no comment since the case has not yet been filed.
Along with Rumsfeld, Gonzales and Tenet, the other defendants in the case are Undersecretary of Defense for Intelligence Stephen Cambone; former assistant attorney general Jay Bybee; former deputy assisant attorney general John Yoo; General Counsel for the Department of Defense William James Haynes II; and David S. Addington, Vice President Dick Cheney's chief of staff. Senior military officers named in the filing are General Ricardo Sanchez, the former top Army official in Iraq; Gen. Geoffrey Miller, the former commander of Guantanamo; senior Iraq commander, Major General Walter Wojdakowski; and Col. Thomas Pappas, the one-time head of military intelligence at Abu Ghraib.
Germany was chosen for the court filing because German law provides universal jurisdiction allowing for the prosecution of war crimes and related offenses that take place anywhere in the world. Indeed, a similar, but narrower, legal action was brought in Germany in 2004, which also sought the prosecution of Rumsfeld. The case provoked an angry response from Pentagon, and Rumsfeld himself was reportedly upset. Rumsfeld's spokesman at the time, Lawrence DiRita, called the case a a big, big problem. U.S. officials made clear the case could adversely impact U.S.-Germany relations, and Rumsfeld indicated he would not attend a major security conference in Munich, where he was scheduled to be the keynote speaker, unless Germany disposed of the case. The day before the conference, a German prosecutor announced he would not pursue the matter, saying there was no indication that U.S. authorities and courts would not deal with allegations in the complaint.
In bringing the new case, however, the plaintiffs argue that circumstances have changed in two important ways. Rumsfeld's resignation, they say, means that the former Defense Secretary will lose the legal immunity usually accorded high government officials. Moreover, the plaintiffs argue that the German prosecutor's reasoning for rejecting the previous case — that U.S. authorities were dealing with the issue — has been proven wrong.
The utter and complete failure of U.S. authorities to take any action to investigate high-level involvement in the torture program could not be clearer, says Michael Ratner, president of the Center for Constitutional Rights, a U.S.-based non-profit helping to bring the legal action in Germany. He also notes that the Military Commissions Act, a law passed by Congress earlier this year, effectively blocks prosecution in the U.S. of those involved in detention and interrogation abuses of foreigners held abroad in American custody going to back to Sept. 11, 2001. As a result, Ratner contends, the legal arguments underlying the German prosecutor's previous inaction no longer hold up.
Whatever the legal merits of the case, it is the latest example of efforts in Western Europe by critics of U.S. tactics in the war on terror to call those involved to account in court. In Germany, investigations are under way in parliament concerning cooperation between the CIA and German intelligence on rendition — the kidnapping of suspected terrorists and their removal to third countries for interrogation. Other legal inquiries involving rendition are under way in both Italy and Spain.
U.S. officials have long feared that legal proceedings against war criminals could be used to settle political scores. In 1998, for example, former Chilean dictator Augusto Pinochet — whose military coup was supported by the Nixon administration — was arrested in the U.K. and held for 16 months in an extradition battle led by a Spanish magistrate seeking to charge him with war crimes. He was ultimately released and returned to Chile. More recently, a Belgian court tried to bring charges against then Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon for alleged crimes against Palestinians.
For its part, the Bush Administration has rejected adherence to the International Criminal Court (ICC) on grounds that it could be used to unjustly prosecute U.S. officials. The ICC is the first permanent tribunal established to prosecute war crimes, genocide and other crimes against humanity.
Germany, who killed millions of Jews wants to prosecute Rumsfeld.
That makes sense.
Nazi Germany was created during a long cold winter
when unemployment was high. People was literally starving and freezing. Leadership had failed to keep the citizens fed and sheltered. Rogue leadership, Hitler, arrives announcing he will bring an end to the suffering. War employs. When there are no jobs, war is the alternative for a country. And pillaging, which is what basically happened, and the attempt at extinctousing an undesirable (to Hitler) nationality. Desperation in a country is a ticket to the empowerment of leadership which could potentially change the course of history. Or maybe we know that as it has just happened to us.
You want 'em, you can have 'em,
nm
name 'em
x
Set 'em up, Joe....
...and it's about time. Joe the Plumber has filed a federal lawsuit against the (now former) head of OJFS (Ohio Job and Family Services) and two assistants. They illegally investigated him after he offended dems and the liberal media by asking Obama a question, then *somehow* the information was leaked to the press. Gonna love following this one.
Keep 'em coming.
I’m going to take a page out of your book again and simply jump over this latest denial/dodge of yours...just like you did with the context post. Blame game bluster scores no points here. The ignorance seems to be unending, but at least you could try to know your own party platform. Think you can handle that?
Bottom line. This is so simple, even you can get it. Dems would impose the R-words (regulatiions and restrictions) on the transnationals....back in the day, we called it monopoly busting. Pubs give them the keys to the candy store, the greed of the wealthy being what it is and all. Gotta keep those CEOs perks coming.
We can all see how well that has worked for us. One does not have to look too far to see just how inept the party has been over the past 8 years in all things economic. Huge surplus transformed to deepest deficit of all times, virtually overnight, gas/food, bank foreclosures, housing crisis, rising unemployment, wage stagnation, inflation/recession. Bush’s latest brilliant explanation for all this is that “Wall Street got drunk. It has a hangover. Don’t know how long it will take them to sober up.” This would be the extent of his experience? Scarey. Maybe he has been reading McCain's joke book. The candidate tells us that the economy “is not his strong suit.” Disarmingly honest, but none to comforting. Speaks for itself.
Touched on this in the economics paragraph in the context post, but you chose to ignore that...or, in your own words, maybe that was the one you were not paying attention to, I forget. In fact, no response from you, Sam, speaks volumes and sheds a whole lot more light on the subject than anything you might actually come out and try to say. Go figure.
If ya can't feed 'em
don't breed 'em
That's the problem with 'em all - they just CAN'T
They're bullies. Both in and out of office.
Ya calls 'em the same way I do.
Most of 'em believe in heaven and he!!, too.
n/msg
McCain sure knows how to vet 'em.
nm
you tell 'em martha
x
Let 'em marry if they want to
then they can have the same privilege straight couples have of paying thousands to divorce lawyers to get rid of what they were so sure was gonna last a lifetime. Straight or gay, that marriage license changes people. I seriously doubt that "gay" marriages are going to last any better than straight marriages. Yeah and they want to adopt kids. What are the 2 biggest problem areas in straight marriages? You got it. Money and kids. So let 'em have at it. Make the divorce lawyers richer. As It happens I don't believe in marriage between 2 people of the same sex and I believe homosexuality is a choice but then I'll leave the sorting out to God. Same as being an alcoholic is a choice. One can choose to fight the temptation or they can embrace it. JMO.
New York is welcome to 'em!! n/m
x
Nothing racist about 'em -
I do not find anything racist about your posts; but I do find the aspirin post racist.
So where d'ya plan to put 'em all?
Tell 'em what they wanna hear.
they are transporting children to vote.... not quite old enough to realize fairy tales are just that....
ride 'em cowboy!
xx
'outlaw' something that so many of 'em got rich
sheesh
Yes, there WERE WMD. The intel was correct....SH got rid of 'em...
.
There are different flavors - Fox "news" is one of 'em.
nm
They're ALL innocent...ask 'em!
x
If it bothers you, don't read'em....I have a job AND a life...
thank you very much. I also have things that are important to me, and the next President of the US and abortion are two of them.
just plain rude - keep 'em coming
xx
Rush Limbaugh taught 'em how!
 Desperate to say something bad, even if they have to fake the film to do it! Because they know their loyal viewers are such sheep they'll believe anything they see on their show as gospel - even if it is debunked later!
Unfortunately the good weather attracts 'em.
I'm a pagan - I guess that'll really freak 'em out, huh?
Talking with the people you describe is like going back to the Dark Ages.
I would think if they bring them here, when they "let them loose", they would send 'em home
x
I wouldn't want to be on the
O'Reilly Factor either. Bill O'Reilly never lets the people talk. He is always cutting them off to speak his opinion. Kind of annoying really. I am no Obama supporter, but I think as a person in general.....I wouldn't want to be on his show. If people have opposing ideas....fine....but let them talk.....stop talking over them.
Wouldn't we all??
LOL in regards to Christmas, very few people actually celebrate the *true* meaning anymore. Our neighbor has already put their lights up for heaven's sake!
Do Jews believe that he was crucified? I mean is it up until the resurrection that is disagreed with? Or is that just based on who you are talking to?
I mean my belief is that Jesus died and rose again and he had to die for our sins to pay our sin debt so we can go to heaven. I also believe he is the only way to heaven, because if not then it was senseless for him to die. But I do believe he is coming back and we will be gathered with him and after the tribulation heaven will be here on earth and those who didn't believe will be "ashes under our feet" as the Bible says.
I know that a lot of "Christians" now don't believe all of the Bible, or believe there are errors, which just amazes me, but hey, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. To me God cannot lie, and if God said the Bible is the Truth, well, it's the Truth then.
I'm sorry if I got heated before. I am a new Christian (I was baptized last November, but I would say I didn't get serious until January) and I knew before that a lot of people are against Christianity (in general) but it amazes me how so many people are just downright hateful about it! I mean yes, I can understand, because there are a lot of hypocritical Christians, a lot of Christians who profess Jesus and then go out into the world and do the same old things they used to, and those were my very same arguments before I believed in Him. But I have met so many more Christians that are just CONCERNED! I mean do people not understand that our belief in Jesus is just as strong as our belief that a chair is really there when we go to sit in it?
I'm ranting again. But what I was discussing with you I am just curious because it seems like Jews and Christians agree on a lot up until the point of whether Jesus was Messiah or not. I guess my biggest question is why don't they believe he is the Messiah?
I wouldn't know.
Since we've never cared enough about the average American to try universal healthcare. We could probably find out how it works from the Iraqis, though, since part of Bush's war budget was to provide comprehensive universal healthcare to THEM.
It's sad that some people are okay with paying for Wall Street crooks to get richer and richer.
We're all about greed, greed, greed. Even with all the publicity about Bush's bailouts, I just heard on the news that the end-of-year bonuses are still in place for the Wall Street crooks.
Seems to me that when a government runs around and buys up banks, that's FASCISM, so if we move to SOCIALISM (which will never happen and which is a ridiculous statement), that move will be a giant step UP from what we have now.
I'm sick and tired of eight years of greed. By the looks of things, the majority of Americans are sick of it, as well, which gives me some hope for what is left of humanity.
Obama is right. "Trickle down" hasn't worked. It's time to try "trickle UP."
Well of course! Why wouldn't I? I, too, am
LOL
I wouldn't be so sure about that
The Catholic heads are really pushing this issue, as are a lot of other Christian leaders. Most people don't like either candidate (like me), but they'd rather vote for the one that settles their conscience.
Add that to the fact that Americans like their guns and McCain has a strong chance. He's really been coming up in the poles (not sure if it'll be enough, though).
You would think so, wouldn't you....sm
or at least grouped by party, which wouldn't really be fair to the minor parties because they would probably wind up on the back of the ticket. I have never used a "punch" voting machine, so I am not familiar with the way that they are read, but wouldn't there be a chance the name punched on the back could be read as being for a candidate that appears on the front of the ballot?
I wouldn't say......... sm
that I'm "un-narrow", DB, because I am probably about as narrow as they come short of those who bomb abortion clinics, etc., but I do understand what you are saying. I appreciate you understanding my point as well.
Wouldn't this have all come up
when his background investigation was done when he was elected Senator? If there was truly a birth certificate issue, I am sure it would have come up during the DSS (Defense Security Service) investigation process.
I wouldn't go that far...lol..(sm)
While Obama is very popular worldwide, he still has to prove himself. I believe he will do an excellent job, but we have a lot of work to do yet.
No, actually they wouldn't do that...(sm)
Keep in mind that Reid was actually trying to stop him from getting into the Senate but couldn't find any legal grounds to do so, and it was both pubs and dems doing the investigation into Blago. Dems don't want him in the senate anymore than the pubs do. From our point of view, he's a has been and can't win an election.
If you want to talk about those all important votes for the stiumulus package, you might want to check out how long pubs have been holding up Franken in Minnesota with court battles. How many times do they plan on counting that vote anyway?
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