Iraqi Soldiers Speak Out in Favor of Murtha
Posted By: PK on 2006-01-14
In Reply to:
On January 5, 2006, Congressman Murtha held a town hall meeting with Cong. Jim Moran (D-VA 08).
The soldier who asked the first question served in Afghanistan and said that morale among troops is high and that he would gladly serve in Iraq today. His comment was the only one replayed by Fox News the next day.
But the majority of soldiers in attendance spoke out against the current policy. Fox News did not broadcast their remarks.
Here are some excerpts.
John Brumes, Infantry Sgt. US Army:
Everything that the Bush Adminstration told us about that mission in Iraq is absolutely incorrect. Furthermore, I'd like to say ... I came home to no job, no health insurance. Until we take care of this war, we can't take care of the problems that matter like health care.
I've witnessed both ends... Congressman Murtha, I implore you to keep doing what you're doing.
John Powers, Capt. 1st Armored Division, served 12 months in Iraq:
The thing that hits me the most is the accountability. ... Where is the accountability for those men [who took us to war], as well as where is the accountability for Paul Bremmer, who misplaced millions of dollars and claims to keep accountability in the war zone?... I know that if we lost $500 we would be court marshaled. So where is the accountability for this leadership?
Garin Reppenhagen, served as a sniper in Iraq for a year in the First Infantry Division:
My question is also about accountability. The soldiers that you see, Congressman Murtha, at the hospitals... those are my friends. After coming back, being a veteran, my question is why? Why did we go to this war, why the hell did it happen, why are we in this condition. A lot of soldiers are debating whether this war was fraudulent to begin with. And there doesn't seem to be a clear answer. A lot of Americans now are debating the fact over whether or not the war was fraudulent in the first place. How come there hasn't been an investigation on the fraudulent lead up to the war by this Administration?
C-SPAN has the full broadcast here.
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Iraqi Colleagues Killed U.S. Soldiers, Military Says
And 19 Republican senators and a conservative poster crashing this this board think that monsters like this should receive amnesty for killing our soldiers. Unbelievable.
Iraqi colleagues killed U.S. soldiers, military says
SAN FRANCISCO, California (AP) -- Two California soldiers shot to death in Iraq were murdered by Iraqi civil-defense officers patrolling with them, military investigators have found.
The deaths of Army Spc. Patrick R. McCaffrey Sr. and 1st Lt. Andre D. Tyson were originally attributed to an ambush during a patrol near Balad, Iraq, on June 22, 2004.
But the Army's Criminal Investigation Command found that one or more of the Iraqis attached to the American soldiers on patrol fired at them, a military official said Tuesday. (Watch a mother's quest for truth -- 1:26)
A Pentagon spokesman knew of no other similar incident, calling it extremely rare.
The Army has conducted an extensive investigation into the deaths but declined to provide details out of respect for relatives of the soldiers, spokesman Paul Boyce said Tuesday evening.
It was unclear whether the investigators had established a motive or arrested any suspects.
The families of McCaffrey and Tyson were to be briefed on the report's conclusions Tuesday and Wednesday by Brig. Gen. Oscar Hilman, the soldiers' commander at the time, and three other officers.
When they come I have my list of questions ready, and I want these answers and I don't want lies, McCaffrey's mother, Nadia McCaffrey, said.
Soldiers who witnessed the attack have told her that two Iraqi patrolmen opened fire on her son's unit. The witnesses also said a third gunman simultaneously drove up to the American unit in a van, climbed onto the vehicle and fired at the Americans, she said.
Nothing is clear. Nothing is clear, she said. Her son was shot eight times by bullets of various calibers, some of which penetrated his body armor, she said. She believes he bled to death.
Nadia McCaffrey has become a vocal critic of the war in Iraq, and said her son had reservations about it, too, though he served well and was promoted posthumously to sergeant.
I really want this story to come out; I want people to know what happened to my son, she said. There is no doubt to me that this (ambushes by attached Iraqi units) is still happening to soldiers today, but our chain of command is awfully reckless; they don't seem to give a damn about what's happening to soldiers.
Iraqi forces who had trained with the Americans had fired at them twice before the incident that killed Patrick McCaffrey, and he had reported it to his superiors, she said.
Boyce said the U.S. military remained confident in its operations with Iraqis.
We continue to have confidence in our operations with Iraqi soldiers and have witnessed the evolution of a stronger fighting army for the Iraqi people, he said.
Patrick McCaffrey joined the National Guard the day after the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, his mother said.
Tyson's family could not be located, and a message left with his former unit was not immediately returned.
McCaffrey, 34, and Tyson, 33, were members of the California National Guard. Both were assigned to the Army National Guard's 579th Engineer Battalion, based in Petaluma.
Sen. Barbara Boxer, D-California, pressed the Pentagon for answers about the case when Nadia McCaffrey was unsatisfied by explanations from the military.
Mrs. McCaffrey is set to receive a briefing from Pentagon officials (Wednesday) afternoon in California, during which we hope they will provide her with a full report of the facts surrounding Sgt. McCaffrey's death, said Natalie Ravitz, a Boxer spokeswoman.
Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. |
|
Find this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/06/21/soldiers.ambushed.ap/index.html |
|
Iraqi PM says Reckles soldiers should stay home.
So much for all that *winning their hearts and minds* talk. 
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060706/wl_nm/iraq_maliki_dc_2
Reckless soldiers should stay home: Iraqi PM
By Ibon Villelabeitia
Thu Jul 6, 1:41 PM ET
Iraq's prime minister urged the U.S. military on Thursday to keep reckless troops from serving in Iraq in order to prevent abuses like the alleged rape and murder of a teenager and her family by U.S. soldiers in March.
Expanding on calls for an independent inquiry and a review of foreign troops' immunity from Iraqi law, Nuri al-Maliki said commanders should do a better job in preparing their soldiers.
There needs to be a plan to educate and train soldiers, and those who are brought to serve in Iraq shouldn't bear prejudices nor be reckless toward people's honor, Maliki said.
The U.S. military is investigating a group of its soldiers over the rape and killing of a family of four in Mahmudiya, south of the capital, in a case that has strained relations between Washington and Baghdad.
Former private Steven Green, 21, has been charged with rape and murder in a U.S. federal court. He had been discharged from the army because of a personality disorder before the case came to light.
At least three other soldiers are being investigated in the case.
The Mahmudiya incident and other incidents before that ... produce sadness, pain and condemnation from Iraqis, Maliki said.
IMMUNITY
Maliki, facing pressure from Shi'ites and Sunnis to hold Americans accountable, has slammed a U.S. occupation authority decree that grants immunity from Iraqi law for the 140,000 or so foreign troops in Iraq, saying it emboldens soldiers.
I think this matter has become necessary to review and solve, either by reviewing the issue of immunity or reviewing the nature of the investigating committees, he told reporters in Baghdad, a day after he first called for a review of the law.
The rape and murder case is the fifth in a high-profile series of U.S. inquiries into killings of Iraqi civilians in recent months and has outraged Iraqis.
American commanders, keen to repair the military's tarnished image after three years of complaints from Iraqis that U.S. abuses go unpunished, pressed murder charges against 12 military personnel last month. Marines are under investigation for the killing of 24 unarmed Iraqi civilians in the town of Haditha.
Iraqis have complained of Americans' lack of cultural sensitivity -- including searching women's rooms during raids or not taking their boots off when entering. Commanders say they are improving such procedures.
Though heavily dependent on America's military muscle, Maliki faces delicate negotiations with its main ally Washington over how to regulate the presence of the U.S.-led forces in Iraq, now under a U.N. mandate that expires in December.
Copyright © 2006 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved. Republication or redistribution of Reuters content is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Reuters. Reuters shall not be liable for any errors or delays in the content, or for any actions taken in reliance thereon.
Copyright © 2006 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
|
19 Republicans vote in favor of amnesty for those who kill our soldiers.
In the Senate today, 19 Senators voted that it was okay for the Iraqi government to give amnesty to anyone known to have attacked, killed or injured American soldiers, and every single one of them was a Republican. I guess this is an example of how Republicans *support* the troops. The only one that truly surprises me is McCain. He must have lost his mind since he began pandering to those who believe they are Bush's *base.*
Vote Summary:
Question: On the Amendment (Nelson (FL) Amdt. No. 4265 )
Vote Number: 178 Vote Date: June 20, 2006, 03:27 PM
Required For Majority: 1/2 Vote Result: Amendment Agreed to
Amendment Number:S.Amdt. 4265 to S. 2766 (National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007 )
Statement of Purpose: To express the sense of Congress that the Government of Iraq should not grant amnesty to persons known to have attacked, killed, or wounded members of the Armed Forces of the United States.
Vote Counts: YEAs 79
NAYs: 19
Not Voting: 2
Vote Summary By Senator Name By Vote Position By Home State
Grouped By Vote Position
NAYs ---19
Allard (R-CO)
Bond (R-MO)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Cornyn (R-TX)
DeMint (R-SC)
Enzi (R-WY)
Graham (R-SC)
Hagel (R-NE)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Lott (R-MS)
McCain (R-AZ)
Sessions (R-AL)
Stevens (R-AK)
Thomas (R-WY)
Warner (R-VA)
Not Voting--- 2
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Shelby (R-AL)
YEAs ---79
Akaka (D-HI)
Alexander (R-TN)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Brownback (R-KS)
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carper (D-DE)
Chafee (R-RI)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Clinton (D-NY)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
Dayton (D-MN)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dodd (D-CT)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Durbin (D-IL)
Ensign (R-NV)
Feingold (D-WI)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Frist (R-TN)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McConnell (R-KY)
Menendez (D-NJ)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Obama (D-IL)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Salazar (D-CO)
Santorum (R-PA)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Schumer (D-NY)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Sununu (R-NH)
Talent (R-MO)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Wyden (D-OR)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/06/20/19-gop-senators-vote-agai_n_23445.html
Ridiculous, isn't it? Mr. Murtha
in his little toe than Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld combined will EVER have. But, hey, let the propaganda catapulting and swiftboating begin..that's all they can do but to smear a marine who served his country for 37 years, was awarded 2 purple hearts and a bronze star, retired as a colonel. I guess support for veterans stops if they disagree with you. What a bunch of lying hypocrites.
I agree with you, especially about Murtha...sm
I would have taken the part about Murtha out except I didn't want to only post part of the article.
It just think it is a GOOD thing that anchors are *finally* speaking out that the Iraqi war was not a smart thing to get in to. That's why I posted this.
That was the first I knew about Murtha except
before the election.
I agree with your statement on the others. I think Pelosi is too pushy and I wonder why she is in such a hurry to pass all O's stuff so quick. I often wonder what kind of background she has.
I watched a program the other night (don't ask who, I'm always flipping channels) and they had a perfect answer for where Gitmo prisoners should go....to Alcatraz, right in Pelosi's backyard and she can then look through those viewers that look out over the bay and watch the prisoners herself. I thought it was hillarious.
Murtha simply wants it investigated, one way or the other...sm
Although I doubt the soldiers have corrupt intent *if* there is any merit in the claims.
Coulter says Murtha should be killed.
It's apparently acceptable to advocate assassination as long as you're a darling of the Republican party.
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002689569
Latest Ann Coulter Outrage: On Fragging John Murtha
By E&P Staff
Published: June 15, 2006 11:55 PM ET
NEW YORK With the brief debate over Iraq in Congress producing such acrimony this week that one congressman suggested opponents of the war support al-Qaeda, it should come as no surprise that columnist and author Ann Coulter would top them all.
In an email interview with John Hawkins at the Right Wing News web site, Coulter was asked, among other things, to offer short comments on several individuals. After harmlessly dismissing former Ambassador Joseph Wilson as the World's most intensely private exhibitionist, she said of Rep. John Murtha, the hawkish ex-Marine and now antiwar congressman: The reason soldiers invented 'fragging.'
Fragging, which became a well-known expression --and occurence -- during the Vietnam war, means soldiers attempting to kill their own officers for one reason or another.
This was so over the top that conservative Mike Krempasky at RedState.org posted, I've said before that's its kind of ironic that just about every phrase Stewie from Family Guy uses to describe Lois could easily be applied to Ann Coulter. Well - once again, Ann proves us right. He went on to call her fragging remark absolutely disgusting....there's no excuse - NONE - for the allusion to soldiers who kill other soldiers. It's despicable - and frankly, so is Coulter.
Coulter's column is syndicated by Universal Press Syndicate. On its home page, Universal hails her witty, no-holds-barred commentaries on the Washington scene. She tackles the hot issues with fervor and stands up for the things that she believes in.
E&P Staff (letters@editorandpublisher.com)
Can we say ABSCAM and Jack Murtha? sm
He didn't take the bribe but put it on a back table for later. Oh, well, no big deal.
Murtha has too much controversy surrounding him...sm
To be taken serious. The dems who voted for Hoyer went with the less controversial candidate and I agree with that. I could see the Murtha witch hunt coming, so I am glad Hoyer go the vote. The conversation America needs to be having is not about a 1980 meeting, but what is going on right now.
Oh, I feel you. I don't know which is better for the Iraqi's, b/c what is usually reported is sm
the military casualties, not the civilian casualties in Iraq.
Fox News did report this week about a military man whose family was murdered, wife and children while he was out working. That's awful, that's terror. When I hear stories like that I do think of the terror the people are experiencing due to this war, but they did have it bad under Sadaam. They're in a catch 22.
Iraqi death toll....sm
See link for full article below.
*According to the graph, Iraqi civilians and security forces were killed and wounded by insurgents at a rate of about 26 a day early in 2004, and at a rate of about 40 a day later that year. The rate increased in 2005 to about 51 a day, and by the end of August had jumped to about 63 a day.
Extrapolating the daily averages over the months from Jan. 1, 2004, to Sept. 16 of this year results in a total of 25,902 Iraqi civilians and security forces killed and wounded by insurgents.*
Detained Iraqi children
Okay, this is about as disturbing as it gets. I came across this thread on the Democratic Underground website:
Source: AFP
Agence France-Presse
BAGHDAD -- US troops are holding nearly 950 children and teenagers in a military prison at a Baghdad base, some as young as 10, a top commander said Monday.
Brigadier General Michael Nevin of US military police said many of these youngsters, mainly 15, 16 or 17 years of age are illiterate and have been detained for planting bombs and even for "picking up a gun and firefighting."
...
"These juveniles have been involved in something that is perceived as a security threat to Iraq or coalition forces," Nevin told Agence France-Presse during a tour of Camp Cropper.
...
"In January we had around 100 juveniles. Now we have around 950," Nevin said.
...
One of the commanders at Camp Cropper, Lieutenant Colonel Malcolm McMullen, said the juveniles were now part of a wide-ranging educational program launched by the military.
"Many of them come from broken homes with no education," he said.
So, curious as to what type of educational program launched by the military, as I thought it funny this little tibit of information was left out, I came across this:
http://www.kavkazcenter.com/eng/content/2007/11/10/9066.shtml
I think we need to dig further.
Obama and Iraqi oil for food...
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/03/obamas_iraqi_oil_for_food_conn.html
The Iraqi war has further destabilized the middle east. It has....sm
But obviously you don't think so so tell us how it has helepd to stabilize the region?
A blog by an Iraqi about his homeland and Democracy. sm
I read this every day until he stopped posting. It's very informative and not something seen in the MSM. There are other links there that are still active.
This is my first time hearing protestors against the Iraqi war...sm
getting soldiers killed??
This is not Vietnam. We are not trying to stop communism from spreading (not that I would have agreed with that then). This is supposedly to stop WMD, then to spread democracy to the Iraqi people, and now because there was a connection to al Queda.
The loss of live was tremendous in Vietnam compared to the Iraqi war. If we had lost the number of troops we did in Vietnam, I would be in Washington sitting on the lawn myself.
Not sure this answered your question, you have to explain your question further??
Iraqi terrorist training camps?
Links between Saddam's regime and al-Qaeda, as claimed by the Bush Administration (which formed a crucial part of the WMD justification for the Iraq invasion), were non-existent or exaggerated, according to the report of both the United States Government's 9/11 Commission and the Pentagon. There was never any real proof of training camps in Iraq. As far as terrorists having been in Iraq at one time or another....it's a middle eastern country.....they were way down toward the bottom of the list of terrorist hang-outs.
John Murtha to appear on Meet the Press today!
I set my VCR! 
War Hero Murtha wouldn't join military now
US Rep. Murtha says he wouldn't join military now
03 Jan 2006 01:00:32 GMT
Source: Reuters
|
WASHINGTON, Jan 2 (Reuters) - Rep. John Murtha, a key Democratic voice who favors pulling U.S. troops from Iraq, said in remarks airing on Monday that he would not join the U.S. military today.
A decorated Vietnam combat veteran who retired as a colonel after 37 years in the U.S. Marine Corps, Murtha told ABC News' Nightline program that Iraq absolutely was a wrong war for President George W. Bush to have launched.
Would you join (the military) today?, he was asked in an interview taped on Friday.
No, replied Murtha of Pennsylvania, the top Democrat on the House of Representatives subcommittee that oversees defense spending and one of his party's leading spokesmen on military issues.
And I think you're saying the average guy out there who's considering recruitment is justified in saying 'I don't want to serve', the interviewer continued.
Exactly right, said Murtha, who drew White House ire in November after becoming the first ranking Democrat to push for a pullout of U.S. forces from Iraq as soon as it could be done safely.
At the time, White House spokesman Scott McClellan equated Murtha's position with surrendering to terrorists.
Since then, Bush has decried the defeatism of some of his political rivals. In an unusually direct appeal, he urged Americans on Dec. 18 not to give in to despair over Iraq, insisting that we are winning despite a tougher-than-expected fight.
Murtha did not respond directly when asked whether a lack of combat experience might have affected the decision-making of Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and their former top deputies.
Let me tell you, war is a nasty business. It sears the soul, he said, choking up. And it made a difference. The shadow of those killings stay with you the rest of your life.
Asked for comment, a Defense Department spokesman, Lt. Col. John Skinner, said: We have an all-volunteer military. People are free to choose whether they serve or not.
Our freedom of speech in this country allows all of us the opportunity to voice an opinion. It's one of our great strengths as a nation, he added in an e-mailed reply.
The White House had no immediate comment.
![src=http://www.alertnet.org/images/spacer.gif]()
Murtha's predictions on the Republican exit strategy.
I'm past convinced but time will tell just how politically motivated *Iraqi freedom* is to this administration. How much you want to bet nobody gets it?
I agree with Murtha, now that we have relieved Iraq of the Saddam regime the mission sould be getting our soldiers home safely. But its not that easy with the new wave of terrorism that replaced Saddam's regime as a result of the war.
I still say though we have our own battles to fight at home and need to accelerate training what Iraqi men are willing to fight for democracy and do what we can to restore their infrastructure and get out. With the right enthusiasm (or upcoming congress elections) it can be done. ~Democrat
------------------------
Murtha Details His Exit Strategy
Jan. 13, 2006
CBS) Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., believes the vast majority of U.S. troops in Iraq will be out by the end of the year and maybe even sooner. In his boldest words yet on the subject, the outspoken critic of the war predicts the withdrawal and tells 60 Minutes correspondent Mike Wallace why he thinks the Bush administration will do it
“I think the vast majority will be out by the end of the year and I’m hopeful it will be sooner than that,” Murtha tells Wallace, this Sunday, Jan. 15, at 7 p.m. ET/PT.
“You’re going to see a plan for withdrawal,” says Murtha. He believes Congress will pass it because of mounting pressure from constituents tired of the war that could affect the upcoming midterm elections.
The political situation will force President Bush to accede to Congress, he says. “I think the political people who give [the president] advice will say to him, ‘You don’t want a democratic Congress. You want to keep a Republican majority, and the only way you’re going to keep it is by reducing substantially the troops in Iraq,’” Murtha says.
The president has said publicly that any decision regarding Iraq would be based on the situation there and not on Washington politics.
Murtha rejects the president’s argument that the war on terror is being fought in Iraq. “The insurgents are Iraqis – 93 percent of the insurgents are Iraqis. A very small percentage are foreign fighters….Once we’re out of there, [Iraqis] will eliminate [foreign fighters],” says Murtha.
“[President Bush] is trying to fight this war with rhetoric. Iraq is not where the center of terrorism is,” he says. “We’re inciting terrorism there....We’re destabilizing the area by being over there because we’re the targets,” Murtha says.
When Wallace challenges him by saying, “General Peter Pace, chairman of the Joint Chiefs, says your comments are damaging recruiting and hurting the troops,” Murtha responds by saying it’s the military’s own fault. “[Troops] are rotated [into Iraq] four and five times. They have no clear mission,” says Murtha. “One of the problems they have with recruitment is [that] they continually say how well things are going and the troops on the ground know better.”
President Bush has said there are only two choices in Iraq: victory and defeat. And he has implied that Murtha is a defeatist. Murtha, of course, disputes that.
There have been 13 servicemen from his Congressional district killed in Iraq. Could the families of those dead be offended? Wallace asks.
“Well, I hope [those families] understand,” says the Vietnam combat veteran. “It’s my job, my responsibility, to speak out when I disagree with the policy of the president of the United States,” says Murtha. “All of us want this president to succeed…I feel a mission here, with my experience, that I have to help the president find a way out of this thing.”
Murtha Attacked by the Right for Quote Falsely Attributed to Him.
Imagine that. I'm shocked. 
Murtha Attacked by the Right For Quote Falsely Attributed to Him
UPDATE: Multiple ThinkProgress readers report that Gail Bulfin of the Sun-Sentinel admits the paper’s report was inaccurate and says a correction will be printed tomorrow.
The South Florida Sun-Sentinel reported on Sunday that Rep. John Murtha (D-PA) had claimed that the United States is the greatest threat to peace in the world:
American presence in Iraq is more dangerous to world peace than nuclear threats from North Korea or Iran, U.S. Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., said to a crowd of more than 200 in North Miami Saturday afternoon.
Though the Sun-Sentinel never provided a direct quote of Murtha, the story was featured on the Drudge Report and Murtha immediately came under attack from conservative pundits:
Bill O’Reilly, Fox News, 6/26:
Murtha has lost all perspective and did months ago, but his message is firmly entrenched in America’s far-left precincts. … [T]hat kind of extreme thinking, based on little evidence, by the way, is putting all Americans in danger.
Tucker Carlson, MSNBC, 6/26:
What is really going on here, and you know it as well as I, is that Jack Murtha has been intoxicated by the amount of publicity that he has gotten from his anti-war crusade, and he has become progressively more unreasonable, progressively more left-wing as the days go on, and he is in the thrall of people who, I think, have hostility towards the United States.
Newt Gingrich, Fox News, 6/26:
For an American congressman to say that is beyond any acceptable behavior, and I would hope the Congress would move to censure him.
One problem: Murtha apparently never said anything of the sort. What he did was cite a Pew poll released two weeks ago showing that people around the world, including in closely-allied countries like Great Britain, believe the U.S. is the greatest threat to peace.
A statement released by Murtha’s office today quotes an email from Melissa Sanchez of the Miami Herald, who also attended the speech, saying of the purported Murtha “quote”: “That was in reference to international polls. It was not so much his own conjecture, but a conclusion drawn from polls in various countries.” ThinkProgress confirmed with Murtha’s office that the email accurately reflects the views of reporters at the Miami Herald.
Email the Sun-Sentinel’s reader liason Gail Bulfin — gbulfin@sun-sentinel.com — and ask that the paper print a retraction. See update above.
Check the source for Observer's Murtha article....
It is from a right-wing pro-war blog called "Politico." If you read a more non-partisan source you'll find that Murtha added a very large caveat to his comment.
Observer's "facts" would be so much more credible if she would quit posting from right-wing partisan sources. If I were to repeatedly or constantly post on the Conservative board what I thought was the "truth" and all backed up by far left-wing blogs/publications I don't think I'd get very far and after I while I'd probably try to provide more non-partisan sources for my statements if I wanted to be viewed as the least bit credible.
Raped Iraqi woman feared US troops...sm
I don't usually post reports of the bad side of US soldiers in Iraq because I believe the most of them are doing their jobs with integrity, so even after reading this it is still hard to believe. Thanks to the brave soldiers who spoke out against their comrades. This story reminds me of some of the bad stories I've heard of Vietnam.
Please somebody say it aint so...
------------------------------------------
Raped Iraqi woman feared US troops: report
Mon Jul 3, 2006 07:06 AM ET
BAGHDAD (Reuters) - A woman apparently at the center of a rape-murder probe by the U.S. military in Iraq was only 15 and voiced fears about soldiers' advances before she and her family were killed in March, the Washington Post said on Monday.
Quoting the mayor of Mahmudiya, near Baghdad, an unnamed hospital official and neighbors of the alleged victims, the newspaper named the woman, her parents and 7-year-old sister as having been killed in their home in the town on March 11.
The paper did not affirm the woman, Abeer Qasim Hamza, was killed by Americans, but local people quoted appeared to believe the dead family was the one involved in the U.S. investigation.
A U.S. military official in Baghdad told Reuters details of the incident they described were at odds with U.S. documents in the 10-day-old investigation of at least three soldiers. U.S. officials had the rape victim's age as 20, he said. However, he added, he was not aware of any other such cases in the area.
The U.S. military has given few details publicly. Officials say at least three soldiers are under investigation over the alleged rape of a woman and the killing of three relatives, including a child, in their home at Mahmudiya on March 12.
Two are suspected of rape and one of these, since discharged from the army, is also suspected of murder, officials said.
The Washington Post quoted Omar Janabi, who said he was a neighbor, saying Abeer Qasim's mother had told him on March 10 that the young woman had complained repeatedly about advances made toward her by U.S. soldiers at a nearby checkpoint.
Janabi told the newspaper he was one of the first people to arrive at the family house after the attack. He said he found Abeer sprawled dead in a corner, her hair and a pillow next to her consumed by fire, and her dress pushed up to her neck.
DEATH CERTIFICATES
The paper said death certificates from Mahmudiya hospital identified the victims as Abeer Qasim Hamza, 15, shot in the head and burned; her mother Fakhriyah Taha Muhsin, 34, killed by gunshots to her head; her father Qasim Hamza Raheem, 45, whose head was smashed by bullets; and Hadeel Qasim Hamza, 7.
The inquiry was launched after two soldiers from the 502nd Infantry Regiment came forward last month to make allegations about comrades. The killings had previously been recorded by the military as the work of guerrillas, U.S. officers say.
Local residents and officials in the area, one of the most dangerous and violent in Iraq, have offered Reuters reporters conflicting accounts of incidents involving U.S. troops.
Two years after the scandal over U.S. prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib jail and coming after a string of murder charges against U.S. troops and accusations over the killing of 24 people in the western city of Haditha, the rape allegation is potentially incendiary in Iraq's conservative Muslim society.
Iraq's main organization of Sunni Muslim clerics, long hostile to the U.S. occupation, said on Sunday the Mahmudiya case revealed the real, ugly face of America.
In recent months, officials say, commanders have cracked down on rogue soldiers in a bid to gain the trust of ordinary Iraqis and of their new government after three years of growing resentment that U.S. officers say risks fuelling the insurgency.
Where was the concern of anyone when Saddam was killing the Iraqi people?
I must say, this is one of the most egregious of all arguments that is made in this country, or any country. Saddam tortured, killed, maimed and raped his own people for decades and not a word was said. Now with a chance for a free Iraq, this concern surfaces. Where was it all these years?
Murtha, Pelosi, Barney Frank, Al Franken!, ughh!.
nm
Afghanistan - war on Al Quaeda and Taliban; Iraqi FREEDOM - kill Saddam Hussein
Two different wars based on entirely different premises.........
Do yourself a favor
don't ever get a job as a seer...because you're totally off base with your analogy.
All in favor, say "I"
Give it a rest. We got more important fish to fry.
I'm just more likely to get upset when it's not in my favor :)...sm
If it's not an honest mistake, it's shameful either way.
Who all is in favor of a polygraph?
I personally think that all candidates should be subjected to a polygraph. This way we won't have to dig through all the BS all the politicians give us and we know whether they are lying or not. LOL! Kind of like our own political BS detector.
Is anyone actually in favor of the bail out?
I personally think that we should just let the banks fail and not save their greedy banker butts. It seems like that's the way a lot of other people feel too. I haven't heard one person say let's save their greedy banker butts. However, I'm pretty sure that congress will bail them out. If I could vote on this, I would definitely say no, no matter what consequence to myself (drop in stock, retirement and possibly the value of my home, no loan for college next semester).
Are there any average Americans out there that are for this?
I'm in favor of choice
So, yes, I want the deck stacked on my side, lol! If you aren't in favor of an abortion, then please don't have one. You can make that choice all by yourself.
Do us all a favor. Go look up the definitions of tax cut
The only way anybody gets money back more than what they pay in is if they earn very low wages and have many children. The income bracket they are in refunds all revenues back to them that they paid in. In addition, they get a tax CREDIT only if they qualify for earned income tax credit or child tax credit. For example, lowest bracket tops out at $7825. Their tax rate is 10%. Whatever they have paid in over $782.50, they get back and ONLY what they have paid over that amount, because this is based on the tax rate. They get more back only if they have qualified for EIC or CTC.
It you get a tax rate cut, you cannot benefit from it if you do not earn wages. These guys also will not get any additional refundable tax CREDIT as that is paid against tax liabilty. If you take issue with this, show me how I am wrong here.
Well, I'm not in favor of bailing out
people who bit off more mortgage than they can chew. Assuming they could read, they should have read the fine print. If they agreed to buy a house for a price, then they owe that amount of money plus interest. That's the way it's always been. I think the governmennt is focusing on these "bad loans" to take the spotlight off the real people...those who bought a house they could afford, have made their payments and now many are faced with losing their homes because of losing their jobs. Those are the ones who get my sympathy.
So you're in favor of this?
You actually think that this bloated thing they're calling a stimulus plan ought to be passed in the House version? Do you really believe that this is the time and place to push through every piece of pork and catering to special interest groups and call it stimulus? Why not just call it the liberal Democrat wish list and let it go as that? This not the time to cater to special interests when our country is sinking economically. I had every hope that Obama would come up with a legitimate stimulus plan, but this is a tragic joke.
Another way to use soldiers
Out of respect for your request, Democrat, I will call myself Starcat.
It seems to me the last sentence sums it up very well, but Bush doesn't have the guts for that, does he? Just canned questions and canned answers.
Bush Teleconference With Soldiers Staged
By DEB RIECHMANN, Associated Press WriterThu Oct 13, 4:35 PM ET
It was billed as a conversation with U.S. troops, but the questions President Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war in Iraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.
This is an important time, Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, said, coaching the soldiers before Bush arrived. The president is looking forward to having just a conversation with you.
Barber said the president was interested in three topics: the overall security situation in Iraq, security preparations for the weekend vote and efforts to train Iraqi troops.
As she spoke in Washington, a live shot of 10 soldiers from the Army's 42nd Infantry Division and one Iraqi soldier was beamed into the Eisenhower Executive Office Building from Tikrit — the birthplace of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.
I'm going to ask somebody to grab those two water bottles against the wall and move them out of the camera shot for me, Barber said.
A brief rehearsal ensued.
OK, so let's just walk through this, Barber said. Captain Kennedy, you answer the first question and you hand the mike to whom?
Captain Smith, Kennedy said.
Captain. Smith? You take the mike and you hand it to whom? she asked.
Captain Kennedy, the soldier replied.
And so it went.
If the question comes up about partnering — how often do we train with the Iraqi military — who does he go to? Barber asked.
That's going to go to Captain Pratt, one of the soldiers said.
And then if we're going to talk a little bit about the folks in Tikrit — the hometown — and how they're handling the political process, who are we going to give that to? she asked.
Before he took questions, Bush thanked the soldiers for serving and reassured them that the U.S. would not pull out of Iraq until the mission was complete.
So long as I'm the president, we're never going to back down, we're never going to give in, we'll never accept anything less than total victory, Bush said.
The president told them twice that the American people were behind them.
You've got tremendous support here at home, Bush said.
Less than 40 percent in an AP-Ipsos poll taken in October said they approved of the way Bush was handling Iraq. Just over half of the public now say the Iraq war was a mistake.
White House press secretary Scott McClellan said Thursday's event was coordinated with the Defense Department but that the troops were expressing their own thoughts. With satellite feeds, coordination often is needed to overcome technological challenges, such as delays, he said.
I think all they were doing was talking to the troops and letting them know what to expect, he said, adding that the president wanted to talk with troops on the ground who have firsthand knowledge about the situation.
The soldiers all gave Bush an upbeat view of the situation.
The president also got praise from the Iraqi soldier who was part of the chat.
Thank you very much for everything, he gushed. I like you.
On preparations for the vote, 1st Lt. Gregg Murphy of Tennessee said: Sir, we are prepared to do whatever it takes to make this thing a success. ... Back in January, when we were preparing for that election, we had to lead the way. We set up the coordination, we made the plan. We're really happy to see, during the preparation for this one, sir, they're doing everything.
On the training of Iraqi security forces, Master Sgt. Corine Lombardo from Scotia, N.Y., said to Bush: I can tell you over the past 10 months, we've seen a tremendous increase in the capabilities and the confidences of our Iraqi security force partners. ... Over the next month, we anticipate seeing at least one-third of those Iraqi forces conducting independent operations.
Lombardo told the president that she was in New York City on Nov. 11, 2001, when Bush attended an event recognizing soldiers for their recovery and rescue efforts at Ground Zero. She said the troops began the fight against terrorism in the wake of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and were proud to continue it in Iraq.
I thought you looked familiar, Bush said, and then joked: I probably look familiar to you, too.
Paul Rieckhoff, director of the New York-based Operation Truth, an advocacy group for U.S. veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan, denounced the event as a carefully scripted publicity stunt. Five of the 10 U.S. troops involved were officers, he said.
If he wants the real opinions of the troops, he can't do it in a nationally televised teleconference, Rieckhoff said. He needs to be talking to the boots on the ground and that's not a bunch of captains.
Copyright © 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained in the AP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press.
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Soldiers are no different than anyone else....
in that there are those who disagree with this administration and the war. However, the overwhelming majority of the military respect the commander in chief and they believe in their mission. But, if you only watch CNN and liberal media, you will not hear from those soldiers. For every article from a liberal source you find that Bush did not listen to leaders, I can find one from a conservative source to counter. We will have to agree to disagree. I do not find this administration stubborn...I find this administration trying to stick to its guns so to speak, doing what is best in the long run for this country as far as countering terrorism. I know you do not understand nor want to understand the danger; however, I do. Every time Reid or Pelosi do something stupid, the liberal media lauds them as heroes and you can go right to the Arab news outlets and see how they pick it up and run with it. Al Qaeda must be lovin life right now. And that makes me SICK.
As to the half staff, talk about stubborness...I do not know and still do not understand why you cling to that as some kind of evidence that Bush doesn't care about the soldiers or people in Iraq, because he ordered a half staff for the VA Tech victims. And why you would say just because we have always done it that way... sheesh. Hanging onto this just screams at me that it is your problem with Bush personally and nothing else. I cannot see how you can find fault with the half staff and criticize the man for showing up at Va Tech. And..frankly...he cannot control what the governor said, but that being said...I do not understand the reaction of the left to it. But then I do not understand the reaction of the left to much of anything. I do not understand how you profess compassion for the Iraqi civilians yet want to cut and run and leave them to the terrorist thugs. That makes absolutely no sense to me. A President showing compassion for those kids at VA Tech, and you don't like that...what kind of sense does that make? The President shows compassion meeting with families of fallen soldiers, and if you look at him you can tell the toll this has all taken on him personally...if you took the time to look...not that you give a darn. I would like to say I understand you, but I don't. I used to think I did, but you have changed. It kinda reminds me of the at commercial I once saw that said: *You will be assimilated. Sadly, I believe you have been.
Who are these many soldiers?
I would be interested in knowing. I did not say you or anyone was Anti American...do not put words in my mouth. You used the word patriotic, I used it back to you. I said it was not illegal...and it is not. Congress voted for it. It is not illegal. If a soldier said it was immoral it is his right, like it is your right. However, when you talk about pulling funding when we have troops in battle, yes, I think that is unpatriotic, and if a soldier said we should pull funding, yes, I would say he was unpatriotic too. I have never heard a soldier say so. I have certainly never heard "many" soldiers call the war immoral either.
For the soldiers
As a tribute to our soldiers I felt a strong need to post this. As a prior US Army soldier I was proud of my country when I served and I am proud of all our soldiers in today's Army, and proud of anyone who decides (past, present, and future), that they love our country so much and the freedoms it offers us to give their time to the military. This is no small step. Your whole life changes in the blink of an eye (or however long it takes you to sign your name) and you will never be the same again or look at things the same as you did before.
The election recently has brought this to mind. I can remember the times my mom sending me an absentee ballot to vote and when I turned it in to my First Sergeant he looked at it and said Soldiers do not have the right to vote. You are a soldier in the Army and you will serve your country. We were "An Army of One" and our individual viewpoints do not matter. (When I joined J. Carter was president and this was the next election when Carter/Regan were running). So I threw my ballot in the garbage and followed my First Sergeant's order as a soldier is trained to do.
I have been reading that 68% of our veterans support J. McCain and only 23% support B. Obama. There is a post below that has an article that is focusing on only those 23%. In any organization you are going to have disgruntled employees, but if you were trying to judge a company would you base your decision on the few disgruntled or what the company employees have to say as a whole about their company.
Here are what some of the veterans are saying about their choices (link will follow below to the actual article) - This is how many in the military feels.
Most military will not vote for Obama, with every rule there is an exception but I personally know that the majority of the military will never vote for someone like him!
Because he is too inexperienced, and unfit to be the commander in chief of the Military!
His stance on foreign policy terrifies me!
He preaches change, but never says what that change will entail, but if you look at his record you can deduce that the change he talks about is a dumbed down version socialism, which sounds nice on paper but never works!
I’d much rather have a Commander in Chief who’s been in the military and one who knows what war is like, and McCain has 2 sons who are both in the Marine Corps and have fought in Iraq…
I’m sick of people telling me that they need to pull the troops out, when I am trying as hard as I can to rehabilitate and get back out there to finish the job! pulling us out would undo everything that we’ve worked for, everything that I sweat and bled for out there, everything that some very dear friends have died for! And by pulling us out you’d be saying that what we did didn’t amount to anything, and those lives lost were in vein.
There is a responsible way of pulling the troops out and there is an irresponsible way. If we just got pulled out of there then there would be a vacuum effect that would turn Iraq into more of a terrorist breeding ground than it ever was before, more so than even Afghanistan. And that would undo everything that we worked so hard to accomplish!!! I have been for this war from the very beginning, and even after facing death, being shot, and having all the surgeries I’ve had since I’ve been home I believe in the cause now more than ever. But even if you opposed the war to begin with we can’t abandon those people now it would be selfish, reckless, and utterly irresponsible to do so and would actually make things much worse for us in the long run.
I’m not the biggest McCain supporter there are many issues I don’t agree with him on but he at least understands all of this, he understands what we are going through over there, he understands combat, and he understands what is at stake in this war that the American people have seemingly abandoned and forgotten, not only our future but the future of an entire nation of people is at risk if we give in and pull out!
Some people don’t think it’s our responsibility to fight for other countries and stabilize their governments but as I’ve said before in previous blogs “It’s a good thing France didn’t have that attitude during our revolution, otherwise we never would have won our own Independence!!!”
Obama is not a competent Commander in Chief! You tell me what exactly he stands for???????? CHANGE? what the he!! is he gonna change? HOPE? what kind of hope? are you kidding me? he never says what the he!! he’s talking about, he just throws out what people want to hear but never provides a solution!!! Most people I talk to that say they’re gonna vote for him can’t even answer those questions, but they’re gonna vote for him because someone they know and respect says they are gonna vote for him! Why don’t you at least look into it yourself and make an educated decision! I can at least respect that! But that doesn’t seem to be the case in most people I’ve come across.
http://twana.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/veterans-against-obama/
One other note is that we need a person like McCain who will be workign towards winning the war and bring our troops home as the hero's they are. Not Obama's idea of pulling them all out irresponsibly and then they'll end up like the soldier's after the Vietnam War. They'll be called everything you can thing of (invader's, murderers, etc.). They'll be treated the same exact way the soldier's were treated from the Vietnam War.
I pray for our troops every day, and will pray until the election is over the the right person (McCain), will win this election.
Do you actually know any soldiers?
Are you honestly suggesting that the soldiers who are on the front lines are less informed than you are?
You think you 'have more opportunity to see the big picture and the real motives behind it' than the men and women putting their lives on the line.
Lady, please get a grip.
Maybe go volunteer at a VA Hospital. Then perhaps you will stop preaching your uninformed views from your keyboard.
I am sure that our soldiers would sm
rather shoot these terrorists too. They can't, they have to do what they have to do to get information out of them.
I can think a whole lot worse I would do to them that would get the information out of them a whole lot faster. Think I will save that though.
Sounds like you want to create a military force of a bunch of "mamby pambies" who do nothing but make sure the terrorists/prisoners are so comfy in their little beds. Good grief should we sing them to sleep to?
What do you think they do to Americans when they capture them? A whole lot more than we ever do to them. Come down to reality will ya?
He does favor sex education for kindergartners...
ABC News' Teddy Davis and Lindsey Ellerson Report: Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., told Planned Parenthood Tuesday that sex education for kindergarteners, as long as it is "age-appropriate," is "the right thing to do."
My question is, what part of sex education is age-appropriate for a 5-year-old? Can't we just let them be kids? Sigh.
And if the lipstick pig thing is a joke...it is in poor taste. In all honesty, I don't believe he actually meant to compare Sarah Palin to a pig. However, it was a poor choice of words. And if you look at the crowd he was talking to, THEY thought he was talking about Sarah Palin. That is why they stood up and had a big laugh over it.
In politics, sadly, perception is everything...and most people perceive he was taking a low blow shot at Palin.
I would favor a federal sales tax if
there were no exemptions whatsoever. If, say you earned a dollar, you owed a dime. No exceptions regarding where the money comes from. Tax welfare benefits too. Social Security is already taxed for some recipients. Those of us who receive Social Security and have enough income to pay taxes on 85% (maximum) of it ALL had the opportunity for a better life. Some took advantage of that and some didn't. Young people today have little hope of receiving Social Security and they also have little hope of being able to live while saving for their future.
In my usual long-winded way, t hat's what I think.
I am not in favor of a federal sales tax....
as much as I am in favor of a flat percentage income tax. For the sake of argument...let's say 10%. No deductions, no nothing. Flat 10%. I don't care if you make a dollar or 10 million dollars. Everyone pays the same amount. Cut back the IRS because if you pay a flat tax you don't need them and the incessant forms and reams of laws. Cutting back on the IRS would save millions in and of itself. Then every American pays the same tax. THAT is equality. Everyone gets the same shake. You make less, you pay less. You make more, you pay more. They should also abolish the death tax. IF the feds have already taxed all your money, they should not tax it AGAIN just because you die. That is unfair to the heirs you worked to provide for. Just my opinion.
DO OUR COUNTRY A FAVOR, show the BC!!!
A ? for those in favor of national healthcare
What is your rationale for wanting government in charge of your healthcare? You have to know that if this happens, healthcare in this country IS going to be rationed, the same as it's been rationed in Great Britain, Sweden, and Canada. There will be long waits for procedures that we now take for granted being done in a very short time. I know Obama promised the same healthcare as he now has in the senate...do you believe him?
Doesn't look like ALL the people are in favor of it. sm
Not even all Dems support it and looks like their support is dropping as well.
The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey found that 37% favor the legislation, 43% are opposed, and 20% are not sure.
Two weeks ago, 45% supported the plan. Last week, 42% supported it.
Opposition has grown from 34% two weeks ago to 39% last week and 43% today.
Sixty-four percent (64%) of Democrats still support the plan. That figure is down from 74% a week ago. Just 13% of Republicans and 27% of those not affiliated with either major party agree.
Seventy-two percent (72%) of Republicans oppose the plan along with 50% of unaffiliated voters and 16% of Democrats.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/business/economic_stimulus_package/support_for_stimulus_package_falls_to_37
Yes, our soldiers deserved better.
I think these are fallen soldiers...nm
soldiers votes
you know, on the news last evening, in a very mild manner, it was mentioned that maybe only 30% of the overseas military's votes will be counted this election, due to mail problems, time constraints, etc. OUTRAGEOUS!!! To boot, this also happened 4 yr ago, and still no one has fixed it (tho 1 senator is allegedly trying). Where are all the hanging chad type screaming complaints, the concern for the (hate this word now): disenfranchised???? IMO this would not be a hard problem to fix, so why is it still broke? A soldier's vote should be most definitely counted, WITHOUT FAIL. Grrrrrr. not to mention, that in Ohio, reported also last night, the homeless can now list their park benches as their addresses, and vote. Mind you, you cannot collect help in the form of welfare/food stamps etc without a solid normal address, but you can vote. nevermind that the homeless are likely uninformed. (don't feed or house them, just give them a ballot and tell them who to vote for...) all the while, our military's votes are casually tossed aside, with an "oh well..." i am still fuming the next day.
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