Fact remains...your guy is in just as deep...

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How is it that people feel they can make these kind of egregious statements about someone so effortlessly and not support those statements with facts. Pardon me if I am a little insistent that credible proof be provided that Laura Bush was drunk when she was involved in the accident that killed her friend.

However, since their alleged departure, the Conservative board is a much more serene, friendly place to visit. There is actually intelligent discussion happening there now, and people's views are being respected and not attacked any more by those three. Hopefully it will encourage more intelligent debate. I even felt free to post there today, because in their alleged absence, I don't feel I will wind up in the middle of a war zone.

You refer to someone wishing a poster to "burn in hell." That's a horrible thing to say to anyone, but I think a bigger question is, how much goading and attacking does it take to get someone to that point?

The Conservative board has almost 1,900 posts on it. Most of these aren't intelligent debate. They're attacks by these three, wherein they attack a single poster 3 to 1, then come back to "high-five" each other after stomping the poster so far into the ground, they just give up. More like a street gang mentality than loving, tolerant Christians.

Though there are also attacks on this board, many of them are provoked by one or more of this "gang." If you take a close look at the Conservative and Liberal boards, the more intelligent, tolerant debate, hands down, is found on this board.

I agree with you that we should move on. I also feel that we shouldn't feel too secure in the peace and serenity that is currently being felt, because I personally believe it will be short lived. I believe in my heart they will be back, because they obviously are "pets" of the owner of this board, and I truly doubt that there's another forum out there that would tolerate them. They seem to harbor too much hatred and rage and anger to be content to stay away from here for too long. Just my personal opinion. I have respected yours. All I ask is that you please respect mine, as well, and then maybe we CAN move on to engage in intelligent, thoughtful, open debate, which presumably is the reason for these boards to begin with.

This country is crying out for help. Government spending is WAY out of control. This is one major reason that I am not voting for Obama. In his charismatic talk of change, he is wanting to spend more money on these so called programs to help the poor and the middle class. Raising taxes will not bail our country out of the situation we have found ourselves in. All I hear about nowadays is how Bush has dragged this country down and now all republicans are bad. Congress is controlled by democrats. They are just as guilty in all this government spending crap. All politicians are to blame for this. Stop the outrageous spending!!!!! Stop padding your pockets full of money while the rest of the country struggles to live! All politicians care about is getting in office and making money for themselves. Do they really stop to think about our country and the long-term effects?

I don't know that McCain has all the answers to help pull us out, but at least I have more faith in him. At least he isn't wanting to create government programs that will up the spending and will ultimately fail to achieve anything. Universal healthcare is not the answer. Doesn't work for other countries....why would it work for this one? Everyone keeps saying how Obama will cut taxes....all of these government programs will not cut taxes. They will increase them.....simple as that.

The true evil here is government spending. STOP THE GOVERNMENT SPENDING!!!! They can tax us until we have absolutely no money left whatsoever and the government would just spend it all and that is the problem.

you have let your perceptions get the best of you. I was not aware, until this thread that Carla had lost someone in Iraq this year. Some of us have not been here as long as others and don't read the hundreds of threads to pick these little nuances up. I'm sorry you have such a huge chip on your shoulder, and if I offended Carla and you I'm sorry, but it still does not change my opinion on the larger issues at hand.

This is from Dean's World, which is a liberal website, by the way. Even this liberal doesn't agree with you. Your Bush Derangement Syndrome has taken an even darker and deeper turn. You might want to spend more time watching the animals and contemplating where all this hatred comes from.

Obnoxious

One of the more shallow memes of the current war goes like this:

Isn't it shameful that President Bush hasn't attended the funerals of very many of the service men who have fallen in this war?

Anyone who thinks very hard about this knows this is an incredibly shallow criticism. Otherwise, the great Generals and Presidents of history, such as Roosevelt, Eisenhower, MacAurther, Patton, Lincoln, and Grant would have never done anything with their time except attend funerals.

Still, if you need to know what history shows, then ask a veteran. As Gulf War veteran John Cole notes, no President has ever regularly attended military funerals.

That's right. Franklin Roosevelt didn't. Harry Truman didn't. Dwight Eisenhower didn't. John F. Kennedy didn't. Lyndon Johnson didn't. Richard Nixon didn't. Ford and Carter didn't. Reagan attended more than most Presidents ever did, but still usually didn't. Bush the Elder usually didn't. Clinton did a couple of times, but mostly didn't.

What if we go all the way back to Presidents like Abraham Lincoln, or George Washington? Turns out that they didn't either.

Why? Because if they did, they would do almost nothing else.

The President of the United States is the leader of hundreds of millions of people. Part of his job is to command hundreds of thousands of people in the military. The next time you vote for a President, I hope you think very hard about that, because that's one of the most important things any President ever does.

But one thing he generally doesn't do is attend the funeral of every fallen service man. Mind you, a good one wishes he could attend every such funeral. A good one feels it like a knife in his gut every time a soldier falls. But he can't be there every time a soldier falls. He just can't.

If you don't understand that, then, to be blunt, you lack maturity

The economy is growing. I don't care if it is exploding. The fact here is that more and more people are becoming more and more desperate. I think going to college is fine but what jobs are these people going to get when they get out of college. You mentioned something about trades...please, all the manufacturing jobs are gone. Small business...only a handful ever succeed. My guess is that most people wiped out of good paying jobs with benefits are supposed to go to Wal-Mart and just pretend everything is okay, and here in Florida, join the service industry. Money, the real god of our times, is what is killing a lot of people here in Florida. As an example, in my town, there are hundreds of small mobile home parks inhabited primarily by the elderly. The big money developers are coming in here, buying the parks and the people are out on the street. The owners of the park get millions of dollars and the people are usually offered a flat fee that would pay rent for about 2 years, or given 60 days to find a place to move their homes, On fixed income this, of course, cannot be done. Many of these folks lived all their lives doing the right thing, playing by all the rules. They moved to Florida, own a little bit of property and now they are expected to rent again and work again. An apartment 1 BR 1 BA that is decent would be around $1000. You do the math. Even those communities that are owned by the homeowners themselves have no say. Eminent domain comes into play and then they are really in trouble so...being elderly, forced out of your home, having Medicare screwed up beyond belief is okay because the economy is strong. I don't care about words or pie charts. I care about what I see and know to be true by looking at it with my own eyes. Just who is it benefitting from this growing economy?? Oh well, the market will straighten everything out, just wait.

Another thing is that everyone is not college material, even these days when a degree doesn't mean all that much anyway. It surely won't guarantee you a job and if you went to college after the 1970s you don't even have to be smart to get in; not that smart people are not in college, you just don't have to be anymore. You don't even have to know how to read..but that is for another day. How many middle management degreed people have lost their jobs...quite a few. Airlines, GM, drug companies, utility companies...all these places hire degreed people. That old sheepskin won't save you anymore.

You say the poor will always be with us and I believe that as well. I do not believe that it is okay to walk over the additional bodies that greed has produced and there are legion. You call it lack of motivation on the part of the poor. I call it greed.

By the way, I see that the Iraq election is mysteriously mirroring the US election, split right down the middle.

Oh, and the drilling in Alaska. Why don't they drill in Detroit and make some cars that use some other form of fuel. It just never ends.