As a matter of fact, it did. And I don't live in India.
Posted By: sam on 2008-09-15
In Reply to: Question: When the economy GREW the 4 years after - 9/11, did your income? Savings? -sm
Job security....yes. I am working for the same company I was then. Standard of living? Has maintained throughout. Savings? I have always put a certain amount of paycheck into savings. That has not changed. I am sure there are many whose experience is not mine; I suspect there are many whose does. That could be said about any 4- or 8-year period...
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As a matter of fact, I do ...
... and as a (rational) independent, I find it really important to know all sides of all stories.
And, until this alleged tape of Michelle Obama is released and proven to absolutely be her, you are basing all of this on really sketchy accusations made by a relatively unprofessional news outlet.
Wasn't enough learned yesterday, upon people ranting and raving about this Ashley Todd atrocity, that accusations should not be put forth as absolute truth until all facts are in?
As a matter of fact, I have been
working at a convenience store during my college years. That is precisely WHY I want stricter handgun control and regulations that would seek to keep illegal handguns off the street and out of the hands of criminals. Obama simply believes that states out to have the authority to regulate and that the fed govt should not impede initiatives that address gun-free zones. For God's sake, if we can ban cigarettes from the workplace, public buildings and restaurants (which smoker's didn't like a bit) surely gun-free zones aimed at public safety (particularly when it comes to protecting children) should not be out of the question.
As a matter of fact, yes it is (sm)
Actually the BBC is known for publishing both sides. So, in this case you wouldn't necessarily go to who published it as much as who actually wrote it. And the winner is.....
Peter Wehner
Former deputy assistant to President Bush
Yes, as a matter of fact I did....
feel that way on 11/3/08. I also felt that way in 2000 when many dems (including myself) thought that Bush stole the election. I was furious, but what was I going to do? Leave the country? Start a civil war? No, I obviously, like the rest of the dems, had to just deal with the consequences, which we are seeing now. This is not trying to slam Bush. This is simply to show that there are huge differences in the parties that have, can and will be overcome.
As-a-matter-of-fact I do need it spelled out
Show me one piece of CREDIBLE evidence that Ayers is in any way associated with Obama's campaign or will be associated with his administration if he has one. And please don't try to feed me stuff like he had a fund raiser for him. Who was involved in McCain's fund raisers? Think they were all lilly white? What about Bush and Cheney's deals? Know much about Halliburton?
I doubt some of you would recognize a terrorist if they jumped up and bit you on the butt.
As a matter of fact, yes I do watch him and you are a liar. sm
He has been heavily down on Bush on many issues, including immigration, his choice for justices, spending to name just THREE. Do you think you can just say these things and get away with it? You do, don't you. Well, the true delusion and paranoia and LIES of the left revealed. SAD, SAD, SAD.
As a matter of fact, I do know what Mrs. Obama meant...
all you have to do is do a little research. Read the papers she has written. She was dead serious in what she said and she meant it..and the only reason she is proud of America now is her husband is running for President. People need to try to see through the spin. She has had the same feelings for years, they run deep, in she AND her husband. That is why they stayed in Jeremiah Wright's church for 20 years, unless you buy the ridiculous story that they went there for 20 years and never heard a "sermon like that." Anybody who really believes that...I have 10 acres of prime real estate (in a Louisianna swamp) I would like to talk to them about.
Laura Bush is just a nice person and would not say anything negative about anyone if her life depended on it. She never said a bad thing about the people who have said very mean, hateful, personal things about her family. I would not expect her to say anything else.
Good grief...John Edwards. Now there is someone to make a quote about two Americas. Any idea what size house he lives in? Gets $300 haircuts? Made millions suing people and channeling dead kids to do it? He is as bad as the people he points fingers at. And he came from poor folks. He should KNOW better. I don't see him living in a smaller house, driving a smaller car, rebuilding New Orleans or anything else with his millions. Yet has the gall to point fingers at corporate America and people BUY that false sincerity. Sheesh!!
Yes, there are bigots. There are black bigots, white bigots, red and yellow bigots. Bigots come from all races. Racists come from all races.
I am not ashamed, nor have I ever been ashamed, to be an American. It is not the country's fault some goofballs live in it. Just like it is not the black race's fault that some of theirs are bigots and racists. Just like it is not every Caucasian's fault that slaves were held 200 years ago, especially Caucasians living now. That needs to be put to rest and the chip needs to come off the shoulders. It would serve us all well to remember that while some Caucasians did enslave people, other Caucasians stepped up and went to war, fought and died in partial reason to abolish said slavery. And if those said Caucasians had not stepped up, it would not have happened. And lest we forget one little tidbit of information...slavery was in existence long before America was. And who did the Dutch traders buy said slaves from? Other blacks who enslaved their own people. All that being said, slavery IS wrong, and thousands of Caucasians fought died to abolish it. So can we please move on?
As to religion...again, good grief! This country was founded by people seeking religious freedom. This is the most "religiously free" country on the face of the earth. The only religion discriminated against in this country is Christianity. Muslims can do whatever they want, wear whatever they want, practice openly, even in school. Christians can't. Buddhists can...Christians can't. And "pure hatred" for anyone who is not in their club...there are offshoots of ANY religion who are kooks. And there are many fewer hate mongers that call themselves "Christian" and give us all a bad name...than there are in other religions. Islam sees no way but their way. They may say otherwise, but their Koran tells a different story. When was the last time Christians went to war for religion? As far as I know, THIS country has NEVER gone to war over religion. And as to the Crusades, yes, that was done in the name of religion. But what people also conveniently forget why...because Muslims were running across Europe killing everyone in their path who did not convert, and aimed to set up shop in Jerusalem, and slaughter as many Christians as they could on the way. Back in the day Christians did not feel like they could let that happen. I sympathize.
All that being said...Obama's problem is not that he is black, although if he is not elected that is what the racists will say. Just like Hillary's people are saying she did not get the nomination because she is a woman. Excuses, excuses, excuses. I would have the same problem with Obama if he were red, yellow, or green for that matter. I don't believe him, I don't trust him. I don't think he has enough experience and the people advising him do not make me feel any better about it. If you look at his voting record, he is one of the most liberal senators, if not THE most liberal. Now he is trying to move to the middle because he wants to be elected. You do not change your whole life-long way of thinking overnight.
Friend, as long as there are human beings there are going to be bigots. There are going to be racists. You will not change that. These are the people who don't have the ambition or drive to work to get ahead and want to blame someone else for their lot in life...whether it is pity me because I am black, pity me because I am poor and white, pity me because the rich people have all that money and I have nothing, and on and on an on and on. You either rise above it or you wallow in it. Nowadays minorities do have it over Caucasians, so the chip really should come off. So we have affirmative action for poor white kids? Uh...no. Do we have special college programs for poor white kids?Uh....no.
When was the last time you had a person of color thank you for your great grandfather dying at Gettysburg? When have you EVER heard that? When have you ever heard one of the black politicians of today say ANYthing about whites during the civil war being willing to split their country and die on the battlefield in part to emancipate slaves and abolish slavery? I personally have yet to hear it. They want to talk about the whites who enslaved them, but they sure don't want to talk about the whites who died to set them free. Now you tell me...is that or is that not racist?
That being said...I think a person should help their fellow man and everyone should have an equal shot, no matter WHAT their color is. And that includes...gasp...caucasians.
Another thing you might do...check your history. The Democratic Party, during the civil war, right after it, up until 1964 tried its dead level best to keep black people from being able to vote. Not until the voting rights act of 1964 were all restrictions lifted. Lyndon Baines Johnson said, as he signed it into law: "We (Democrats) may have lost the south forever (meaning the votes of southern white Democrats...now there is/was a racist group). But, the Democrats had to think fast about how to rebuild the base...and how do they do that? Well, enter Lyndon Baines Johnson and the War on Poverty....and entitlement programs out the kazoo. And there was born the new Democratic base to take over for the old one...and the fact that the Democratic party had been the ones with the foot on the neck of black people for 100 years was forgotten.
How many black people today do you think even KNOW that? I would venture not many, as it is no longer taught in school and revisionist history has taken over.
All that being said...I think it is time to put that away and not continue to hold it over the head of every American, especially since the wrong was righted by Caucasian folks on civil war battlefields and the Republicans (Abe Lincoln was one) then and right up until the voting rights act of 1964 hammered at the Democrats until they gave in. But you don't hear much about that anymore do you? No,not a peep. All you hear about is racist America, and most folks think Republicans were responsible all along, which is a bold-faced lie. History does not lie. Check it out.
That is why I LOVE this country and her people, black and white, yellow and red. Because for all the griping, all the poor pitiful me's, all the excuses, there are those who are still willing to put their lives on the line for this country and her people. God bless them, I say. They are the fabric which holds us together. God forbid that at least some of us will always remember that and be grateful.
Yes, I love my country. I am proud of her history, her start, and my heritage. My country has never disappointed me, though some of my fellow citizens certainly have and continue to.
When it became me, me, me, instead of we, we, we....sigh.
As a matter of fact, I work with a group...
who provide help and counseling to women/girls who find themselves in this position. We have referrals for adoption if that is the choice the person makes. If the person elects to keep the child (and I am pleased to say very many have), we have several agencies which help with that. We have businesses who will provide jobs. We have housing referrals. And we do not stop supporting once the baby is born. We have a network of volunteers who will help with babysitting while the mother works until she can afford daycare. And most of the girls who make the decision to have and keep their child are very motivated to provide for that child. If it takes a week, a month, or a year, we help with that. We have had girls come in after an abortion wanting to talk to someone and we try to help those girls cope. The abortion providers are nowhere to be found when the regret sets in. And often times, it does set in. I am also glad to say that some of those girls have joined us as volunteers. So I do put my money where my mouth is. It is a very small fish in a very large barrel...but if one baby is not aborted, I consider it a victory.
As a matter of fact, I read it against last night.
fu
As a matter of fact my youngest son was born...sm
on the day Nixon announced her would resign. I still have the headlines from that day.
If the govt. is going to let my job go to India, they can
"I'll take that in $20's, please."
China, India, Europe.....
I was in Italy once and couldn't swim because the local shoe factory had just poured all their dye into the Med and it was red. Most of the world drive cars with leaded gasoline. We do more to preserve the environment than many countries.
The Americans going to India is a new thing on me....
i will have to research it tho. Although, when I think about what it costs to travel to India and the cost of the operation on top of that...that is strange. But I will look into it.
As to the prescription drug thing, you are correct. However, not being able to get an operation you need vs having to pay more for a drug...seems like apples to oranges to me.
My main gripe about socialized medicine is number one, the financial burden it will place on ALL taxpayers, and number two, having centralized health care administered by the government.
I am not opposed to everyone sitting down, providers, insurance companies, etc. trying to lower the cost of health care, which is what we need to do, not trot out a huge entitlement that cannot sustain itself. We can't just keep throwing more money at things. Eventually we need to solve the root problems.
Just my two cents.
Thanks, I will check out the India thing...
as to the other....and the East Tennessee thing proves the point. Lower overhead, offer the drugs at a reasonable price, and if the rest of the pharmacies want to compete they will have to do the same. It works in other areas of business, it should work with drugs too. Wal-Mart has started with their $4 and $9 prescriptions. I invite everyone to go there, read what is offered and the qualifications. It is saving a lot of people a lot of money! It is the same if you have insurance or you have no insurance. Some states don't allow it but in any state where they can, Wal-Mart offers it. Go check their website. Yes, it is the generic not the brand, but a lot of us take the generic anyway. I do for BP. That is $4 total cost to you. Anyway...those of you on prescription meds...check out the Wal-Mart website and see if it is available in a Wal-Mart near you.
Maybe the transcription was outsourced to India! nm
nm
Any of you live in the midwest? Just in case you live down the road from me...
I live in Wisconsin and am often also in Minnesota.
No, I'm not a stalker or a weirdo (my opinion, anyway).
Yeah, tell me again how liberals want to live and let live....what a joke!!!! nm
why not just tell the truth? That only extends to liberals.*I have had it with Republicans...* a whole group of people tossed out like garbage. *I will not respond to your posts nor read them.*
As to Ann Coulter...the left has their share..Michael Moore, AL Franken...do you ever look at your own party?
That is the most INtolerant post I have seen here in a LONG time.
Liberals true colors always come out...regardless of how much they say they are the MOST tolerant, and want EVERYone to live and let live...everyone if you happen to be liberal.
We are all Americans...and America is about debate. Tell me, liberal Democrat, again how you care about ALL Americans. Talk about ringing hollow.
Do some research on outsourcing to India and its origins...
Bill and Hill...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/07/AR2007090702780_pf.html
Dell's "tech-support" is already in India.
Just as the British did in India and the American missionaries in Indochina. SM
It has finally come to the point where those of us who are aware and know what is coming and what we face will have to leave the rest to their own devices. The really funny thing is, the liberals and their philosophy are especially loathsome to the Muslims with their support of gay rights, abortion, etc. It's quite a contrast.
The fact that an article was written does not make it fact. I hope you know that. nm
.
Here are a couple of links in regard to Americans traveling to India for surgeries..s/m
If you "Google" "Americans traveling to India for medical care", or the like, there are oodles of articles about this. I pasted two below...
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0816/p03s03-usec.html
http://www.myhealthcollection.com/heart_disease_5.htm
Bill Clinton and his ties to India (yes, Bill),...
and China (yes, Bill) sent a lot of our jobs their way. Google it some time. Even I was amazed.
Look, it is simple economics. The big bad corporations everyone hates...first of all, it is not 5 or 6 rich guys and that's it. They employee thousands of people just like us...and when the government puts those huge taxes on them, if they want to stay in business, they are forced to move offshore. Higher taxes are responsible for more jobs going overseas than "greed." The DNC has told its members for years that "corporations" and "the rich" are the cause of all their problems and they have bought that Marxist rhetoric hook, line, and sinker. Corporations are not the cause of ill in this country. They are the backbone of the economy in this country. That is simple economics 101. And I am certainly not rich...and I certainly am not on the upper echelon of a corporation, but I do understand reality and I understand how the economy works. Yes, there is wrongdoing by some upper level folks in corporations. There is wrongdoing in the government. Where there is power, there will be wrongdoing. But for every Enron there are thousands of other good, solid companies that employ thousands of Americans, but the DNC does not share the success stories, because it does not promote their agenda. In order to control people they want them beholden to government and hating free enterprise. They want big government, total power, and control. And following Alinksy's program...you have to instill class warfare. You have to make corporations the enemy. You have to make classes envy the next rung up. Classic Marxist socialism. It is being played out in this country every day.
It is just that some of us have not bought the myth and jumped on the socialism train.
live and let live
I read your post. It is based on accusations, which is all anyone can really go on as Hitler is not here to pick his brain. It also states Hitler felt they were capitalists, which was a reason why he wanted to destroy them. I also know what my many NYC jewish friends talk about when we talk about WWII and concentration camps which we have talked a lot about over the years. As an aside, from someone who calls me hateful all the time, you do need to look within. To call Chomsky despicable filth for no reason other than you disagree with him and his ideology is really quite scarey and sad. This is America, where we can believe and worship anything we want and if a person does not like it, they can put it out of their mind and live their life and let Chomsky and every one else, who does not think like you, live theirs. Long live Chomsky and every other Communist, Socialist and Capitalist in America. Viva America!!
we DO want to live and let live
We just get a might testy when a board specifically set up for our group is invaded by people who just want to name call, endlessly recycle false propanganda, and obsess over foibles. Separate but equal, I say. You can go to the conservatve board and just rehash and regurgitate all 10 Fox talking points and you won't be bothered by me, rest assured.
I live on the GC.
I don't hate anyone! They ignored the warnings and blamed the government because they did not listen.
Again look at Andrew and Ivan people prepared and then WORKED to rebuild their lives and they did not blame FEMA.
I am not from PA, but I live in PA....
and the people I know were offended. And so they should be. Lots of folks in flyover America are offended. He made a blanket statement and it offended a lot of rural folks whose jobs are on their farms. There are a lot of people in PA whose jobs have not been outsourced. That is the trouble with blanket statements. There are a lot of small towns in PA and not all of us are bitter. We do not cling, we embrace our second amendment rights and our religous beliefs...through good times and bad. If we did not, then we might indeed BE bitter.
Obama does not know me. And I suspect he does not know a lot of rural America. Our vote counts too. Maybe he should not have painted such a broad stroke.
Maybe where you live......not here
I have known plumbing business owners my entire life and they ain't rich by a long shot. They do okay. They employ lots of people, which should be the main concern here.....employment. They perform a service you sure as shoot would want.
Same with electricians. Both professions are tough jobs and I have no problem with them doing well if they can. My brother worked for a plumbing company when he was younger and was called out in the freezing cold to crawl under homes to replace pipes, homes that might at any minute collapse they were so old. He found himself in so many dangerous situations replacing pipes. H@ll fire....they couldn't pay him enough for what he did.
Electricians crawling around in spaces I wouldn't want to go. In the middle of summer here in the south, one had to crawl around in a very small space above our home to run wires and you couldn't pay me enough to do that job. I thought they were going to pass out from the heat. I was more worried about them.
And the A/C - heating guys. Aren't you glad they're there when you need them. Do I want to see them taxed out of business? Who would?
I'm sure good 'ole Obama would want one of them showing up in the middle of the night if his heat went out and he wants warmth. Of course, he has the money to pay for that middle of the night housecall. We don't but that's not the company owners fault. We're slapping down the very people who keep this country rolling.
Obama is a joke! Snide hypocrit.
I and others do not want to live like the
people from the Holocaust had to. This is coming from other countries too.
Obama's own words - I will change the world. That will not be his job if he is elected. People from Germany see hitler in him. People in Brittain say he's a bad choice. People from all over say the Obama camp was how Hitler rose to power in Germany. Not my words theirs.
So go ahead and praise lord Obama. Others have enough sense to see him for what he is.
Most of us do not live
in your parallel universe on the fringes, including a good number of life-long REAL conservative economists found in my citations. It does not take more than a minute or 2 to come up with references and resources, that is if you do anything else with your time other than spend it reading the info on walls of the right-rag outhouses. It comes as no surprise you cannot find any info from the real world there.
But suit yourself. You don't have time to educate yourself or do any research before you open your potty mouth? Fine with me, but don't expect anybody with a triple-digit IQ to take you seriously.
Ain't bipartisan support a b*itch?
Don't know where you live, but in LA,
they cannot arrest someone who is a known illegal criminal who has already been deported, unless a new crime is committed, so police can spot dangerous gange members whom they have already arrested and deported in the past, but there is nothing they can do until another crime is committed. It is ridiculous.
Where do you live?
If you voted for Obama, you are one of the two types of voters. Now, you either live in an area where there is enough working people that you never really see the downside of where all your taxes really go, or you know plenty who mooch already and feel you must stick up for them for some reason, why is that? Afraid you won't be "loyal" or do you feel you're entitled?
I believe in working for a living.... unfortunately, our government has long since forgot what a sovereign country is all about and managed to create an entire welfare country in just a few short decades!
Do you live in CA?
x
I don't know where you live....
but people do not jack off in libraries in my neighborhood. Evidently, since you are implying this is LAW or a proposed bill that is imminent (which it is not), you have failed to notice that people are NOT flaunting their wedding tackle in your local library.
Because MOST of them live off YOU and ME!!
--
I don't know where you live....(sm)
but you should really try getting out of your little box. The issue with marriage isn't whether or not a man and woman can marry, but rather whether a gay or lesbian couple can marry. Remember Prop 8? That would be the law that just recently passed saying it was illegal for gays and lesbians to be married. They previously had this right -- It has now been taken away with Prop 8, funded by the religious community.
What's the matter?
Hit a nerve? Did I offend? Good.
What's the matter? No one is
week.....Camelot is coming apart! Actually, glad to see the pubs are big enough not to be saying *told you so.* Does all the questions about past associations make more sense now? It just keeps getting deeper and deeper and dirtier and dirtier. But, of course, if you have drank enough of the Obama kool-aid all of this too shall be whisked away. I know, I know, let's just give him time. He's going to make things better, yes he can!
What's the matter?
su
It won't matter which one. sm
Both are beholden to special interests and the ruling class. A lot of people are oblivious to it, but there is a ruling class. The candidate I supported did confirm this, and so do a few of the candidates running on the third party tickets. Ever wonder why things never change and get worse, this is why.
There is a diary by a blogger on Daily Kos that explains it very well. It is very informative and worth the read.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/7/27/65732/1557/694/557641
what does that matter?
My nieces and nephews are raised by their white mothers... my grandson is being raised by a white mother and a white grandmother and a white great-grandmother, my stepchildren are being raised by their white mothers - that does not change the situation of how the world views these kids... and it does not change how they view themselves. Every one of the mixed kids in my family has a different answer for whether they are white, black, or biracial, and their answer does not necessarily go along with the color of their own skin.
I also think that being raised by a "white" grandmother was part of Obama's problem. She was an older generation, still scared of black people, and she was teaching Obama to be "white" and when he got older he realized that he was not "white". Because he looks like a black man, he obviously feels what a black man feels because he is treated in the world as a black man.
Yes, mixed children are beautiful - but they are "different" than us in that they are neither white or black and they are treated differently for that reason. I hope that changes before my grandchildren get older, but so far, they are still expected to conform to being white or being black...
If a mixed child acts white, he is accepted by the white kids and taunted by the black kids, if he acts black, he is taunted by the white kids and accepted by the black kids. The mixed children have to be taught from birth that they are a mixture of 2 heritages and to embrace both of them; but at this point, they still choose one or the other.
you can think all you want.....it just won't matter with him
!!
It does not matter! It is just that a man has sex with
a woman and a woman has sex with a man.
This is it! And this is right and normal !
Anything else isn't.
How can the government legalize it when it is morally wrong.
Again: I wished Miss California had won.
Would it matter?
Would it really change your mind? Or would you dismiss it away?
Have you ever read the Bible from start to finish with an open mind? Or even just the book of John if you don't want to devote that much time to it.
If you really want proof, try that. Seriously.
No matter how you try to say it, it's still
Since you're so concerned about teaching children right from wrong, it would be perfectly acceptable and should always be taught to children to never EVER call names, make fun of, or bully anyone! There is absolutely no reason whatsoever to even bring up the word 'homosexual' now is there?
If you teach a child not to bully or pick at anyone then you are teaching tolerance aren't you..... without even bringing up the word.
How hard is that to understand!?
What do you mean it does not matter?
Of course it matters. There isn't a draft registration if the intent isn't to SOME DAY have a draft!! Otherwise, what's the point in it? Use your head! It's to have a pool of young males to pull into govt wars!!!!
Just because we at this moment have a volunteer armed forces doesn't mean it will HAVE to stay that way.....
it can change on a whim!
Good for you...Where you live that is...nm
I live near MacDill and know
some people there, including my stepdaughter. They have been talking draft for some time now. My friends are against it; they feel working side by side with someone who does not want to be there is demoralizing. The administration, however, is rabidly obsessive about this and we all know what happens when they get their sights set on something. Also there has been much talk of foreign persons serving in our military, sort of like the French Foreign Legion; romantic...yes, practical, hardly. On the one hand we have the ** fears and queers** tactics spun to perfection by this administration. If anyone other than they are in office, we will be attacked. Cheney even got on TV and said Ohio, Florida and Pennsylvania would be prime targets if Kerry was elected president, what a coincidence these were swing states with a lot of clout. And if the terrorists didn't get us, the homosexuals would. The fear tactic has worked wonders for them. What does not get much press (imagine - and us with a liberal press and all) is the government's willingness to allow complete open and free access to our country in certain instances....Dubai company running shipping ports, some ports of entry not being scrutinized at all, like say Tampa Bay, about 1 mile from MacDill, better known as CentCom. And now, they think foreigners in our military is a good idea. If that is not a shot direct to the heart of operations, if that is not aiding and abetting and enabling and empowering enemies I don't know what is. We can't know all sorts of things because it will **empower the terrorists** and we have to sacrifice our privacy and our rights because *the terrorists gonna get us..** but we are not only going to allow, but invite foreigners to join our military ranks, at the same time as building a 700-mile wall to keep foreigners out. Nuff said.
I live in upstate NY
I believe in G-d, most of my liberals friend do as well, but not all of them. I have a few conservative friends who are athiest.
If you live on the GC, you were paying about
nm
You must live in another country! Sorry, but the
I was better off, made more money, paid lower taxes, and had more job security during the Clinton Administration than now. Same with all my MT friends & co-workers.
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