Also try Mother Jones - they delve into both sides sm
Posted By: CDW on 2009-01-14
In Reply to: Oh, I forgot about BBC - Older MT
of politics and don't hesitate to skewer whoever needs it.
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Both sides should have a choice, on both sides, pregnant woman and doctor...nm
bm
dow jones
http://www.the-privateer.com/chart/dow-long.html
don't blame the new guy
Dow Jones drops again
Down another 7 points today. Was O speaking today somewhere? Reporters are saying don't get too comfortable if the average goes up a couple days in a row because it just seems to keep dropping. If so much good is happening in this country, why does it keep dropping?
Oh, you mean like Clinton with Broaddick, Willey, Paula Jones? sm
Kinda like that?
Alex Jones predicted 9/11 two months before it happened.
I know this is old (July of 2001), but I just came across it and thought it was worth sharing with liberals.
http://www.prisonplanet.tv/articles/august2004/082604alexwarned.htm
Huh.......must be that PT mother you so
xx
How many did your mother have?
xx
Does your mother know you are up
x
Does your mother know
su
They are all in this together, even the mother, ..sm
The mother should have told her..'I am not going to take care of your 6 children anymore, stop having babies', BEFORE she went through IVF.
This are all poor people who use this 'babymaking scheme'
to abuse teh welfare system.
Exactly....and that happens on both sides...
in all seriousness...without the jibes...I have two big issues with the Dem candidates, that being the abortion issue and the endless tax and spend for social programs. I am not against social programs, I am just against the waste associated with it and the constant assault on the paycheck. The average in the US is 30-35% of your paycheck off the top in taxes. Can't we all agree that is enough? Why create more programs or throw more money at programs that aren't working? Why not look at the programs and cut the waste. Look to helping people better themselves instead of pushing assistance higher up the income ladder. Because it is we in the middle class who suffer the most. Pretty soon there will not be any middle class at all, because they will then be the working poor on the assistance that goes higher up the ladder.
There is such a thing as a conservative Democrat...who believes in fiscal responsibility.
And I will be the first one to say that the Bush Adminstration has strayed way away from that...fiscal responsibility. While I agree with him on some things...I sure don't agree with him on that.
I fear Hillary's national health plan because I know Canada's is not working the way it should...and it is horribly expensive to the taxpayer. Up there, their median is 50-55% of their taxes off the top, and the #1 place for that money to go is the universal health care. And even if you have the money to pay for an operation, you can't jump the waiting list. Hence, they come here for it.
I would just hope that whoever wins will look at the long-reaching ramifications before just jumping in. Be that Hillary or a Republican....because I do think Hillary will get the nomination. I can't see it go any other way...unless something drastic happens between now and the primary. Of course, we won't see all the ugliness (on both sides) until a little later. I guess the proof will be in the pudding.
What do you have against 2 sides
su
Yes, they can be - on BOTH sides.
Someone makes a wise crack about it being nice to have someone with a triple digit IQ - when in FACT they don't know what Bush's IQ is OR the possible that Barack has a higher OR lower IQ score. The problem is the people who post don't know. They have just an outright hatred and loathing for the republicans. Well how would they feel if I went and said Obama has an IQ of 68 or something so absurd. They wouldn't. You know what, having a high IQ doesn't mean squat. I know a lot of people with degrees and high IQs and they are more of imbs than people without degrees. Just another put down for Bush they they think is cute and funny. It's not! We get it already. They don't like Bush, they hate him, and some of them like my MIL will come right out and say what they want to happen to Bush (i.e. the same thing Hillary said would happen to BO and that is why she is staying in).
I'm really getting tired of the utter hatred and disdain for Bush, and the constant Bush bashing I see on this board. Calling him stoopid, etc, etc. when there are no facts to back it up (unless they are sitting with his school transcipts on their desk). You know I like Obama. I think he's an okay guy. I don't care for Bush. Never have, but this utter hatred and lies get to be a bit too much. Then of course they find websites to try to "validate" what they are saying, yet they won't post websites that go against what they are saying. I'm just sick of the whole thing. The next 4 years should be interesting. Not going to say O is going to fail, but I'm also not putting him up on a pedistal and praising him while I dance around in circles chanting his name like most on this board are doing. Then again if he does fail I expect no comments from the libs on that one. For him it will be okay.
Origin of Mother's Day.
Published on Friday, August 26, 2005 by CommonDreams.org
Mother's Day in Crawford
by Medea Benjamin and Gayle Brandeis
When Cindy Sheehan marched into Crawford, Texas to ask President Bush why her son died in Iraq, it was Mother's Day. Not the Hallmark-infused, soft focus, breakfast-in-bed Mother's Day that shows up on the calendar in May. This was the day that Julia Ward Howe envisioned when she created Mother's Day in 1870 as a time for all the mothers who lost their sons in the Civil War to protest the senseless violence.
Howe's Mother's Day Proclamation begins:
Arise then... women of this day!
Arise, all women who have hearts!
Cindy Sheehan has risen up against the senseless violence of this war in Iraq, and countless women and men have risen up with her. The numbers at Camp Casey continue to swell, and support pours in from all corners of the globe. While George Bush says he feels Sheehan's pain but must get on with his life, Sheehan's supporters are uprooting themselves from their lives-often at great personal sacrifice-- to vigil beside her in the hot Texas sun. Tired of seeing our soldiers and countless Iraqis die in an unjustified war, millions of Americans-especially mothers--are joining Sheehan's revolution of the heart. And in the process, they're exposing Bush's own heartlessness for refusing to meet with a grieving mother, and more tragically, for needlessly putting our sons and daughters in harm's way.
Those in the smear-Cindy camp have told Sheehan, in no uncertain terms, that she should go back home, where she belongs. But Sheehan has followed Julia Ward Howe's imperative:
As men have often forsaken
the plough and the anvil
At the summons of war,
Let women now leave all that may be left of home
For a great an earnest day of counsel.
Sheehan's hoped-for day of counsel with Bush may never arrive. But another sort of counsel is taking place, the sort that Howe imagined:
Let them meet first, as women, to bewail and commemorate the dead.
Let them solemnly take counsel with each other as to the means
Whereby the great human family can live in peace.
This is precisely what is happening at the vigil in Crawford, Texas. Women are running the camp itself, organizing Sheehan's schedule, holding women's circles to share their grief and hope, writing letters appealing to Laura Bush, and strategizing ways to broaden and deepen this movement for peace.
During the Vietnam era, the anti-war movement was fueled primarily by students. Today, the anti-war movement is being fueled largely by mothers. Look at some of the organizations that have been created in the last few years: CODEPINK: Women for Peace, Gold Star Families for Peace, Military Families Speak Out, Raging Grannies. All of them reflect a mother's intense desire to not only shield her children from harm but to stop her children from doing harm to others.
Again, we hear the voice of Julia Howe.
We, the women of one country,
Will be too tender of those of another country
To allow our sons to be trained to injure theirs.
In a recent statement urging Americans to listen to Cindy Sheehan, Elizabeth Edwards said, If we are decent and compassionate, if we know the lessons we taught our children, or if, selfishly, all we want is the long line of the brave to protect us in the future, we should listen to the mothers now. Thanks to Cindy Sheehan, the mothers have arisen. Thanks to Cindy Sheehan, the world can't help but listen. Hopefully, George Bush is also hearing the message.
Medea Benjamin and Gayle Brandeis are members of CODEPINK: Women for Peace, a group that has been actively involved in the vigil in Crawford, Texas. Medea Benjamin is co-founder of CODEPINK, founder of Global Exchange, and nominee for the 2005 Nobel Peace Prize. Gayle Brandeis is the author of The Book of Dead Birds, which won Barbara Kingsolver's Bellwether Prize for Fiction in Support of a Literature of Social Change.
I bet you have. Your mother must be so proud. nm
nm
As the mother of an interracial son
I can tell you that I see my son as biracial but the world sees my son as black. No matter how much I stress to him how special he is to be of both races when we fill out school papers, doc office papers, etc. we are forced to choose between black or white. This is a visual world we live in and if Obama was running around calling himself a white man then people would have a problem with thst too.
I am a mother...So flame me if you want..however. sm.
Our son is 11 and can debate the pros and cons of both Obama and McCain, Biden and Palin with the best of them. We have taught him that conservativism is the way we think, but everybody is entitled to their own opinion. We are a minority - being conservative in a rapidly turning libral world. And my husband is one of those people railed about...an "angry, white male who clings to his guns and religion."
Our country is going down the tubes, politicians and bankers are raping our country and getting away with it, we owe our souls to the company store aka China et al, and who pays for it??? We do..our children, grand-children, and gg-children.
To those who think that Obama walks on water...google Ayers, Rzko, Wright, Soros, and You-Tube. Listen to any conservative talk show..if you can find any, and listen. With all the overwhelming evidence about Obama and his "friends" etc, we are on a long, slippery slope to destruction of the greatest country there ever was. The founding fathers are spinning in their graves with what our country has become.
Ok, off my soapbox.
does your mother know you are on this board?
how old are you?
and my mother recently said to me (sm)
It doesn't matter who wins...when it is time it is going to happen, regardless of what we do. If he is meant to be in office he will be. God's plan will come to pass no matter what.
Recollections of my mother
Her mother got $.25 a week for groceries to feed 8 kids. Many a night they had ketchup bread or if they had it, sugar bread (toast with butter and sugar), potato or pea soup. Meat was a luxury and they might have had chicken once a month.
They worse shoes with cardboard in them when the soles wore out. Everybody wore the next-in-line older siblings child's clothes when they outgrew them unless they were . My aunt stated by the time the clothes got to her, they were patched so many times the thread hurt her skin.
Their idea of play was to go to the coal yards and pick the best coal they could and get it home without getting caught by the Iron Police.
They didn't have a car. They didn't have a radio. They would hear news by going to the store and listening to their radio.
All the kids had to quit school when they were 16 so they could get a job and help out at home. At that time, the only jobs for boys were in the coal holes as breaker boys and slate pickers and the females cleaned houses or worked in the garmet factories. They would hand over their paychecks when they got paid (which was not on a regular schedule, either). My mom worked for $.10/hour cleaning homes 5 days a week. My aunt made $.08/hour 6 days a week in the garment factory. Out of the pay, they would receive $.50 to do with what they wanted and it had to last until the next payday.
His MOTHER was a U.S. citizen
Good Lord, this gets more ridiculous every day.
No, her mother did not.......posters like YOU did!
xx
As a mother of 2 teenagers . . .
I have had many discussions with them regarding the responsibility that comes with trying any substance, and I told them that if they were going to experiment with something, I would much prefer they smoke pot than drink alcohol, as in my state the rate of alcohol-related teenage deaths is alarming. Of course, I told them that, unfortunately, pot is illegal and so using it would constitute breaking the law. But we as parents know that our kids are going to be exposed to all manner of things and I would rather they be intelligently informed of all consequences.
My mother always told me
Ignore them and they'll go away.
Uh...that isn't what I said. I said it happens all the time and both sides do it.
Are you sure you read MY post? Just wondering because it didn't sound like it from your response. Man, you guys are trigger happy!
Is good, but not see here. Sad for all both sides.
x
Could it be possible there are 2 sides to the story? sm
The US, UK, and Israel also have a long and colorful history of 'creating incidents' to further their own agendas. I would say control of the Middle East is something at the top of the list. Hezbollah is wrong to send rockets into Israel. In fact, they are all wrong, but what do you expect them to do just wait there and be incinerated by Israel?
I'm sure both sides are represented.
There are soldiers for the war and those against. It's all there if you look hard enough. Absolutely....both sides are well represented.
Both sides say things like that
Obviously, living up someone's rear-end is not something that is to be taken literally - that is why I called it a joke - maybe not the best terminology.
My problem is when people say things about certain groups of people and they mean it literally - hence the reason that I specifically mentioned Anne Coulter's discussion and did not add anyone else mentioned in the OP's message.
This kind of crass talk happens on both sides of the fence. Do you have anyone in your family that is a registered Democrat? Do you lump them in with your comments about liberals? (also in comments on the conservative board) I have close family members that are registered Republicans. That is why I do not make sweeping remarks about all Republicans or conservatives. I'm trying to be very specific in my comments because everyone is obviously different.
Racism is on both sides......not just one
xx
Both sides of this issue.....sm
The emotional part of me, that loves wildlife, absolutely and completely hates this practice. The governor before Gov. Palin did this, as well.
Intellectually, however, my husband and I talked about this last night. I have to realize that things are different in the state of Alaska, and we down here in the lower 48 can't judge them for this, as we don't understand all the facts. Sam posted them down below. It's a different mindset, when it comes to predator control versus the herd availability for the people of Alaska who are subsistence hunters, and need that caribou to make it through the winter.
I would much rather to let nature take its course, and let the predator and prey take each other out, the way nature intended it. However, throw humans in the mix, and it does change things.
All that taken into account, I still don't have to like it. But I can respect Alaska's decision to do this, even if I disagree.
Yep. there are two sides to every story....
you just have to choose the side that fits your view for your country. Godspeed in your search. :)
On ALL sides--does not necessarily mean sm
this fiasco is partisan--only that the current administration (GOP) allowed all entities to run amok. It's the financial world versus the common man, now vice versa. As one pundit said tonight, The public shouldn't have to pick up the broken chairs when they weren't invited to the party.
Hey, the hate has come from both sides.
It's so extreme now.
There are SMs from both sides of the fence
Take the above posts, for example:
Fitzgerald renews interest in Rezko-Obama deal
If you read anything on here, read this.
This should disturb every honorable citizen
Your stereotypes are inaccurate and pretty boring.
I can see both sides of the argument
Yes, many people are getting threatened and businesses getting picketed for supporting Prop 8. You cannot deny that (what was the pink taliban or whatever that disrupted church service a month or so ago?)
But on the other hand, if they want these donations anonymous, than that means Obama and other politicians can make their donations anonymous, and I think it's the publics right to know who is financing the next leaders of the country.
I just find it interesting that the homosexuals are assaulting and threatening supporters of the Prop 8 for what they believe in when they themselves are asking for fair treatment for what they believe in.
I am patriotic. I look at both sides.
It's certain people that refuse to look at the PRESENT ISSUES, not the PAST. I am all for O doing the right things, but right now, it looks like business as usual with the exception of his cabinet picks and this stimulus package.
Sticking to the issues is one thing. Calling some unpatriotic just because they don't agree with you is another.
nasty on all sides
Can't we just state our opinions without calling each other "idiots" and "children?" Does that really enhance the argument? Ever?
There is ignorance on both sides here.
As a Christian, I would appreciate it if people would leave this type of subject out of our children's education. It is not unreasonable to ask since we have given up God and prayer in the schools to accommodate those who do not believe.
There are some people who will ridicule the act as well as the person as you can clearly see when we get on the subject of homosexuality. But you cannot group all of us into this category. I do not agree with that lifestyle but having no reason to treat them poorly. That is what I want to teach my children. We may not agree but we cannot be mean to them.
However, I cannot stand by and allow the teaching that homosexuality is okay. It is too controversial of a topic for that to be taught in schools.....just like religion. I can teach my children acceptance of people without teaching acceptance of a lifestyle we don't agree with and I would appreciate it if schools wouldn't undermine my authority on that subject.
You don't see me going around forcing religion on children who I know has parents who don't believe in God and don't want their kids hearing about God.
I was merely stating there are TWO sides....
to every story. I have not taken sides, as apparently you have. That is all I am saying. The Palestinians are not without fault either, and their present governing body are on the terror watch list. That should mean something....?
Right! Definitely hate from BOTH sides. The OP
nm
I don't think there's a limit to what a good mother will do,
be it grizzly or human, when her child is taken from her, and no valid, truthful explanation is given as to why.
Look at the lengths Beth Twitty is going to in Aruba. She wants answers, as well.
Somehow, though, it seems worse when you entrust your child to your government and then, once the shock and disbelief has passed and most of the other grieving stages have passed, you wake up one morning and realize the man you believed and believed IN, the president of the United States, deceived and lied to you and continues to lie to other mothers all over the country. My heart goes out to this brave woman and all those other mothers who also have lost their children. If Bush had 1/1,000th of her courage, this country might be in a much safer place today.
Okay, I get it....liberals believe that the mother's choice....
trumps the baby's right to life. I get it. I do not agree. And it is not a "religious" issue, that is a misstatement. There are many who are not "religious" who do not believe abortion should be legal either. I do not split hairs; I believe life begins at conception, it is ridiculous to stay anything different. If something grows, it is alive. That is science, has nothing to do with "moral issue." So why not just tell the truth? That a mother's choice, in your eyes, trumps the right of the baby to live. I do not happen to agree with that. And I cannot understand how you keep on and on and ON about "all living things" yet are okay slaughter of innocent babies by the millions every year in this country. Abortion results in a dead baby, regardless of the "soul" issue. As to moral issue...killing someone is against the law in this country. Murder is illegal. If a mother waits a day after the baby is born to kill it, she is a murder. Just because the baby is now outside the womb? Gimme a break. If you want to give a woman the right to kill her baby, so be it, that is on you. But at least call it what it is.
Scott Peterson was charged with two murders...Laci's and Conner's. If Conner was not "alive" how did Scott Peterson murder him? There are many states who charge a person who kills a pregnant woman with two murders. See how ridiculous it is to state that, then turn around and say if Laci had chosen to kill Conner, that would have been okay, because it is HER uterus.
All that being said...we all have issues that are important to us. I believe the issue of abortion is very important. I believe the right of the child to live trumps the right of the mother to dispose of it like yesterday's trash. I am entitled to that opinion, and I am entitled to try to get a law overturned that was unconstitutional on its face. I am entitled to try to get it on a ballot in individual states so that the people of this country can decide if they want to, in their own states, legalize abortion. I am entitled to choose a candidate who will work toward those goals as well. That is not the only reason I chose this candidate, but it is an important one. And I am entitled to never vote for a Democrat for the same reason, just as you have the right to never vote for a Republican for whatever reason.
And as to my "religion..." That is also why I obey the law of the land, which right now is legalized abortion. I don't picket abortion clinics and shout at women going into them. I don't shoot at doctors who perform abortions. And if, by God's grace, some states are allowed to pass abortion laws, I would hope each of you would respect the right of those states to do so, just as I have respected the law currently in place. There will always be places to go for abortions, and if Americans can go to India for surgeries, women who want to kill their babies could surely find a state to go to to have it done.
You want to champion a certain segment of society (the poor, unfortunate, suffering....). I want to do the same, only my segment is the most vulnerable, the most defenseless, the most at the mercy of others, the unborn children. Why does it grate you so much to have voices speak for them? Do I, and others like me, not have that right? Apparently not, in your eyes.
I still shake my head in disbelief that your caring for "all living things" does not extend to the babies and how you can justify their destruction on the altar of "choice," and not only that, but castigate those who would speak for them. God forbid it ever comes to the day that another has that kind of power over YOUR life, to decide if you live or die. God forbid!
I was an unwed mother with a republican mom.
I got accused of being promiscuous and my mother raled on and on about how much I had embarassed her and the family before I could get a word out of my mouth about being virgin when I was date raped and ended pregnant. Abortion was illegal then and BC had not shown up either. That issue was surronded with all kinds of shame and blame. I was wisked away to an unwed mother's home the day after I graduated from high school (age 17, 4 months along) in the middle of the night where I hid out for the remainder of the term (which was more like a prison term than a pregnancy term).
The Catholic religious establishment who ran the home never missed an opportnity to let me know what a slut I was and how I did not deserve to be a mother. That was the extent of the social support system in those days. I was then forced to sign my first-born son over to "fit parents," just 5 weeks shy of the legal age of 18. The paper said that I had "no parental rights" and that I would never be allowed to find my own son.
This was the reward I got for being a straight-A student and staying virgin until date rape happened. I was, shall we say, fairly outraged by the time I got to college and proceeded to live up to my mother's worst expectations of me. I became promiscuous for about 2 years or so, took drugs and drank my way through my freshman and sophomore year, but high, drunk or sober, I was ALWAYS front and center in the Women's rights rallies, supporting pre-Roe-Wade initiatives.
I stayed like that until my second son was born at age 26, a year into my marriage. I kicked my habits, straightened up and raised him, but to this day, whenever I entertain the idea of looking for my first son and my second son's big brother, those words, "No rights" and those "slut" attitudes echo in the back road of my memory, and I just remind myself how I have to learn to live with it (as if).
With that being said, my mother would have NEVER, NEVER, NEVER put me in the position SP has now thrust her daughter into. She has only ignited the fires of outrage smoldering inside of me for the past 42 years. We would not be having this conversation if SP had looked before she leaped. For me, there is nothing she can do to convince me that she is deserving of this office. If she had the guts some of the other posts say she has, she would refuse this nomination. So trying to stand back and be respectful of her family privacy...not as easy as it sounds, but for the sake of her daughter, and my own, I will be giving my best shot.
The unwed mother above whose life
nm
(And so is my 82-year-old mother, who has voted
how was the mother making the choice?
she was giving a speech on stage... and who was using the baby for anything? we wouldn't have even known if the cameras didn't keep flashing back to them!
How can you be worried about the safety of the baby when it is family members and close friends holding it? I mean, I'm trying to see your point, but it's still stretching a bit...
His own mother signed him up as Muslim
This was at a public school in Indonesia, where other faiths are taught as well. The records are there in his mother's handwriting. She signed him up not to have Christian lessions but Islamic.
I hear ya on that. My husband's mother
moved a trailer onto our property to get away from property taxes. We decided to rent her trailer. Bad mistake. A minister from our area called us and said this family just moved to the area but really had no place to go and nothing but a few suitcases. Would we rent our trailer to them? Mind you, 2 adults and 4 toddlers trying to squeeze into a 2 bedroom trailer.
We were hesitant, but cut the rent since the pastor vouched for them. I even went to all my friends and wrestled money, food, or cleaning items from them so this family could get a good start.
Three months later, the trailer looked like a dump. The hardwood floors were all full of dirty diapers, feces, etc....and the people did not even own an animal! The toilet backed up (kid stuffed a stuffed animal down it and they never told us). We tried to get them out the lawful way but it didn't work (winter coming, can't evict during the months of September through April).
Finally, had it and my husband put a note on the trailer with a butcher knife and told them if they didn't get going, he would bring a backhoe in and push the trailer over. They were gone the next day and it took us 3 months and 6 tri-axle dump trucks worth of garbage to get the place cleaned up.
Needless to say, after that, I called the pastor and told him what had happened and he was heartsick. He said he found out that the husband, through this pastor's kindness, had job offers like crazy to help this man, and he refused every job that came along! The pastor apologized to us but it really wasn't his fault. It was this man and wife who snookered everybody in the area. They left the area owing thousands of dollars through the generosity of others (I'll pay you back when I get a job.)
We sold the property a few months later to our best friends who also wanted to buy a property but couldn't pass the credit lines at that time. They could afford to pay our mortage, so we made an agreement with the bank and every month, they paid the mortage payment on our property and the property taxes on their property. They're still living on that property and they have no mortgage. It's free and clear. They even built up enough credit with our bank that they could build a house on it and get rid of the gosh-awful trailer.
His mother remarried an Indonesian man
nm
Obama's mother was an atheist......sm
She did not believe in God or Jesus or anything taught in the Bible.
Christianity does not work the same way Catholicism does. If I understand the Catholic faith correctly, if your parents are Catholic, then you are automatically Catholic and are christened as a Catholic in infancy. However, with Christianity, a person does not become a Christian until they accept Jesus as their personal Lord and Saviour. Once profession of faith in Christ is made, baptism follows as a sign of obedience but in and of itself imparts no salvation.
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