Actually, your post here is very thoughtful...sm
Posted By: ms on 2008-09-12
In Reply to: are you really that afraid of open debates you need to - MTpockets
and quite frankly, these days on this board, it's all a big joke to a lot of the democrats, you must agree with me on that one. What they see as jokes, and crude comparisons, usually are just plain crude, and are quite free with their zingers. I was trying to stay with the Halloween season, as I believe that last one from them was something about pig masks and lipstick for halloween. But I digress. My post was meant as a joke, but obviously not taken as one. My apologies to whoever mistook me.
But seriously, though, almost anytime there is a serious debate here, there's a few women on this board, with, shall we say, slight leftward leanings, who swoop down and ridicule the republican posters. Just watch...they are waiting to descend as oon as they see my post.....
They did it to me last night. Why would I want to engage anyone in that kind of senseless attack
As for your thoughtful post, I disagree with most of it, although I am polite enough to allow you your views.
Freedom to choose, freedom to post, freedom to be kind, freedom for hope and change.....
I'm not a rich republican. But I sure want to be able to think for myself, and work for myself, and take care of myself. I don't want any part of the socialism reform that Mr. Obama wants to bring about. I say no to big government. I say no to tax cuts that are really just a one time rebate to the poor, and then everything else will be hiked.
I say help people to help themselves. Don't keep them down on the "so called" welfare plantation. Enable them to help themselves, not take care of them from cradle to grave.
I applied for unemployment once, in my early 20s. It was an extremely horribly feeling, putting myself in the hands of someone who got to decide if I was telling the truth, and deserved to have unemployment. Much as I imagine it feels for those who have to apply for welfare, and social services.
But there are programs there for those that need them now. Those that need them, can have those services. We don't need bigger, and more of them.
Health reform? Yes, health care needs reforming. But social medicine doesn't work. Ask all the people in Canada that die before they can get in to see their specialist. Ask all the MS patients who can only have one drug prescribed that is covered under their social programs...they have to pay for everything else out of their pocket. I just did a tape on that very thing...shocking how long one has to wait for health care in a social society.
Social societies doesn't work.
Just look at your history.
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Very thoughtful post...
....and I too, have tried to be objective, and listen to all sides.
But what I come away with, is this:
1. Economy. Neither one knows much about how it works. Obama was just a lot of rhetoric again last night (so my husband said, as I had to work). But if you really, really listen to him, he and Michelle are all about class warfare and class envy, and being for the little guy, when they are the big guy, and really on the opposite side of most of the people who think that they can "save" them in all things and make them completely dependent on the govt for work, jobs, healthcare, etc. That's a welfare state, and I DO NOT want a govt who has control over every aspect of my life. Give me tax cuts across the board for all, not just the poor and middle class (the poor don't pay taxes anyway, so really, they're not getting a tax break from nothing, are they?). Wait and see if you only tax the rich more..they alrady pay most of the taxes anyway...but there go the jobs for the poor and middle class, if the wealthy can't afford to stay in business....Tax cuts for all is proven to stimulate all aspects of the economy. More taxes, on just the rich, will not.
2. Foreign affairs. Picking Biden was a mistake. While trying to compensate for his own lack of experience, he picks someone with experience...but he is more of the same in Washington....when Obama is supposed to be about change...I don't think I need to explain that one..
3. Health care...yeah, it's a mess, but keep the govt out of it, please. It'll be worse, much worse if they are involved. Socialized medicine does not work.
4. Iraq. They're kicking us out anyway, and we're leaving anyway, so for Obama to say he will get us out of Iraq, is a non-issue, because it is going to be happen without him, and the next prez will be bringing most of them home anyway.
5. I do feel we are safer post 9/11. Bush has kept us safer than you or I will ever know. But truly, I do not want a president who will "talk" to our enemies, and make them see reason. Obama doesn't feel like we're threatened by any of these terrorists, and he is wrong. And you don't talk to terrorists.
6. No, being imprisoned in a POW camp does not make you qualified to run a country. But the character that shapes and defines you from that experience, does. He was a leader when he refused to be granted release early, and insisted on every POW to be released before him in the order they were captured. That took courage, and character.
I believe McCain has more strength of character than Obama.
Yes, I agree with you that Obama seems like a good, family man, that says that he has only our best interests at heart. That's doesn't make him ready to lead a country. And I shudder to think of a more socialist welfare state, that he wants to put us all in.
Wow, thanks so much for that post, really thoughtful and true!!.....nm
nm
Thoughtful post. What bothers me is that religious
nm
Very nice, thoughtful, kind considerable post. sm
Also very small and closed minded. It's your way or no way.
I really wish you guys were nicer, but it doesn't seem to happen, does it?
Really, really good points, just shows how complicated it all is! provocative thoughtful post, than
nm
actually your thought is very thoughtful...
I have been a Democrat for as long as I canb remember, and at the age of 51 years I find myself no longer wanting to be a Democrat, and I certainly do not want to be Republican. There are many valid points in your post; they make a lot of sense. I see this country going straight to the highest bidder; we are quickly becoming a Third World country and it's heartbreaking. Many of us here come from a background of hardworking, honest families, our parents raising us with what they had, and honestly, most of them did not have much. I too am extremely fristrated at the fact that some people on assistance fare better than the most of us who get up, rain or shine, to do what's expected - WORK. I know people on assistance who have said 'why work when I don't have to?..wtf!!?!?!?!!?
A good friend of mine who is a Social Worker has related to me time and time again that it makes her so upset and angry to have people come into her place of work getting assistance who are driving new cars, living in better housing than she is, etc. I too could go on and on but in my many years of living and paying taxes - SOCIAL PROGRAMS ARE INDEED A FORM OF SLAVERY and have hindered more than helped. I was a young mother and I was on assistance for only three years, and in that three years I did go to school, get training to become a MT and with the grace of the one above - WORKED. I also have MS; have had it since 1990 and if I did not have the health plan I have, my Avonex would cost $1,200/month. My MS is progressing but I am working but in Jan 2009 with the advent of voice recognition, my job will be no more. I was even told by my neurologist that I am not 'sick' enough to be placed on Social Security Disability; so I wonder what will happen when I no longer have a job, cannot afford my meds? It's frightening to say the least but I just think its criminal that someone who does not want to work can go to the nearest county assistance office and get help when I know I would be given the 3rd degree if I needed help. There is a LOT wrong with THAT
Oh, it was thoughtful alright............
not much intelligence involved though. All the run around speeches he gives for those who refuse to see it, just are nothing more than he says one thing and completely intends to do another. It's not that hard to hear for those of us who aren't falling for that Obama love fest you have going.
Wow, what an intelligent answer, and thoughtful.
nm
Thanks, very kind and thoughtful of you to point that out....sm
I must have been thinking of the democrat they compared him to at the time, Gerry Studds.
P.S. Please scroll down after reading above post. Washington Post article included.
Reprinted in Boston Globe. Sorry!
I wrote: I second JTBB's post, 'watcher's post is misinformed crap...sm
pYou have also to read what's posted 'inside' the message.
Oops, meant to post this under the loose trolls post...
I'm going to keep ignoring these troll posts. It's kind of fun, actually, just pretend you don't see them.
Post the direct link. I don't see the post you're referring to.
t
The post I quoted was the entire post. It was not taken out of context. sm
I imagine there are as many emotions and thoughts going on with our troops as possible and each does not feel the same as the other, which is obvious by the posts here.
Sorry gourdpainter, my other post should have been under the wacky Pakistan post (nm)
xx
Why did you post this? Republicans have been asked NOT to post here..Bye Bye.
Why did you post this? Happy Thanksgiving is enough but to be so happy we have a republican president? Why did you post that? I would like to remind you, you are on the liberal board. Are you trying to start trouble? If so, let me know and I will report you immediately. No, Im not happy we have a republican president, a warmonger chickenhawk president. Does that answer your question? Now, go back to the republican board. We dont want you here and actually the moderator and administrator have asked republicans not to post here..Bye..bye..
Forgot to post a link in 1st post. Sorry.
http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/money/tax/article1996735.ece
Please refer me to any post where I referred to either the post...
or the poster as ignorant. And I certainly never sunk to the levels you did at the top of the post, against a man who is ill in a wheelchair. Pot calling the kettle black...?
I re-read your post, and I stand by my post.
You are twisting his words by saying that he wants to make friends with terrorists. That is not what he said.
Ya gotta understand the rules. We have to post on this board only. They can post on any board they
The above post explains a lot about everything else you post!
Your revelation about being married to a career Army guy explains why your views are skewed so drastically to the far right! I thought it had to do with small-town Pennsylvania, but now I truly understand where you are coming from. Thank you for explaining that us. We will read your posts in a completely different light now that we know the truth.
If you want to post something on the subject, post
objective views. This is a one-sided publication that asks for donations to keep it going. Nothing I read in there posts anything against any democrats, just republicans. It is not a fair-minded reporting.
I like to read both sides of the aisle but this publication spews hatred for anything not democratic in order to sell books. To those who can't see both sides, this blog, or publication as they like to state, is just up their aisle. I shake my head at one-sided news. Taken from their web site:
"Indeed, a founding idea of the Consortium for Independent Journalism was that a major investment was needed in journalistic endeavors committed to honestly informing the American people about important events, no matter what the political and economic pressures.
While we are proud of the journalistic contribution that this Web site has made over the past decade – and while we are deeply grateful to our readers whose contributions have kept us afloat – we also must admit that we have not made the case well enough that this mission is a vital one.
Robert Parry broke many of the Iran-Contra stories in the 1980s for the Associated Press and Newsweek. His new book, Secrecy & Privilege: Rise of the Bush Dynasty from Watergate to Iraq, can be ordered at secrecyandprivilege.com. It's also available at Amazon.com, as is his 1999 book, Lost History: Contras, Cocaine, the Press & 'Project Truth.' "
I second your post and 'watcher's post
is misinformed crap.
My post was a direct answer to the direct post...
of Democrat. It was not a blank open-ended statement. And dial it back a notch...it is certainly your right to protest anything any time you want to. Just like it is my right to protest you protesting while men and women are still in harm's way, because you are in effect aiding the enemy. Apparently the Viet Nam experience taught you nothing. Americans protesting in the streets heartened the enemy and when they were about to surrender decided not to, based a lot upon what was happening in the American streets. I believe that the protesting in that war prolonged the war and cost more American lives. Hanoi Jane should have been tried for treason. That being said...lessons were not learned and the protestors are doing the exact same thing now. Exercising the very right bought for them by shedding of American military blood. And I still say common courtesy should keep people out of the streets and off the TV until the military are home safe. But it just proves the same thing to me over and over...the selfISHhness of the protestors vs. the selfLESSness of the military. They continue to put it all on the line for your right to protest anything you want to protest...it is up to YOU to decide where and when that is appropriate, and it is up to you to take the heat for same. It is up to me and others like me (in my opinion) to apply that heat. Go ahead and do whatever your conscience or lack thereof moves you to do. But do not expect those of a different mind not to protest the protest.
Thanks for the post. I think I will look up that
article.
And thanks for pointing out all the other "results" of his administration that, as you say, benefit nobody but the rich and/or the corporations or, as he himself once publicly bragged, "his base."
I know for a fact that when he ran for President in 2000, I told every single person I knew that if he becomes President, we're going to go to war with Iraq. (Nobody's gonna treat his daddy like Saddam did and get away with it.)
I didn't have a crystal ball. I had common sense and a good memory from the Gulf War when his father was President and how he didn't "finish the job." Seems a lot of other Americans forgot about that.
I really enjoyed reading your post and all the facts you raised that I failed to raise in mine. Thanks for the mention of the LA Times article. I'm going to try to look that up on the web. 
I know they don't. I said that in my post. NM
//
Actually, that post is right on. sm
You sound like a total lunatic, out of control and full of hatred. You sound like someone who could do just what "vs" says. You had best take a look at your behavior. YOUR posts are the ones who should be reported. You are one frightening person.
Re your post
From your post:
"Did you read Mein Kampf? Would that be good enough evidence for you, because he wrote about it in there."
Wrote about what? That the Jews were socialists?
This is an entirely different post.
Really wasn't directed to you anyhow.
your post is just sad
I'm actually feeling sad for you right now gt. You obviously don't know what Christianity is about. Pat Robertson does not speak for me, and I don't endorse what he said. I'm sorry you are so bitter and hate filled that you would wish anyone to burn in hell. There are some evil people in this world but my first wish for them is that they find Christ and turn from their evil ways with His help. I too hope one day you find Christ, gt, and quit letting misguided Christians and Christian leaders keep you from HIM. Their blunders are not worth your eternal soul.
thank you for your post
What a great post, so heartfelt and I thank you for it.
Yes I do. see my post below. nm
x
The post.
You think there is only one patriot here? Get a trip on your sour shrivled heart and try not to speak.
Whoops! I made a mistake. My bad.
This is the post where the NEOCON tells the LIBERAL not to speak ON HER OWN BOARD!
They can't show a post of a liberal telling Army Mom not to speak because it doesn't exist.
Where did you get that from my post?
Really? I did? Where do you read that in my post? I talk about taking care of the middle class and that the rich really dont give a darn about the middle class. I talk about a friend who is quite smug and out of touch with real America. No where do I mention anything about Kerry or Kennedy.
please post
I would appreciate it if you could post statements from Black Americans that they are okay with Bennetts comments.
What does that have to do with gt's post
I said if we had posted something like that we would have been castigated. You're just proving that point. I'm not in a pissing contest with you...really
And another *right-on* post!
I agree with every single word you said. America is becoming a very scary place indeed. I believe, as you do, that there are people who are eagerly awaiting the *Rapture* and indeed believe they have the *inside track* to heaven. Unfortunately, it look as if this country might actually suffer from their self-fulfilled prophecy if it continues going backwards in time under Bush's completely inept leadership.
Please keep posting. I really enjoy reading your posts.
Thanks very much for your post.
It makes me feel a lot better to hear someone say they're against this. When express outrage at my posting about the issue, instead of expressing outrage about the issue itself, it truly makes me wonder.
I honestly do not recall any threads on the conservative board about this issue. All I recall is total silence (or attacks) when the issue is mentioned.
I also wasn't trying to imply that the crime of child molestation is more prevalent in one political party or another. Obviously, that's irrelevant, and I have a hard time even associating a criminal like that with any political views one way or the other.
It's just that this seems to be a no-brainer, an issue on which virtually everyone can agree, yet the right seems to be eerily quiet when this topic comes up.
Thank you for this post!
Thanks for this post!! I heard about it somewhere but in the chaos that has become my life lately, I probably would have completely forgotten about it..so glad you submitted this..
Please see my post to you above.
I made a mistake and posted my reply in the wrong place. Sorry.
This post had nothing to do with the US...
being a guiltless superpower. It had to do with devaluation of life and a moral decline and what that can inevitably lead to. As to your post, yes, many bad things have happened in many countries...yet if you stack up the dollars, the American lives, that we have poured into human rights issues around the world, you will see that we are far, far ahead of the rest of the world. Nobody can do it all, but America as a country has been the least likely to turn its head in those cases. As a side note, I am of Cherokee and Choctaw descent and I do not believe, nor have I ever, that America as a country has thought my ancestors subhuman. There are always, within any culture, those who set themselves above others. Even among Indian peoples they enslaved other Indian peoples. No one, no culture, is blameless; and no one, no culture, can fix it all. However, as a country, America's record in giving of aid in money, human technical support, human military support, etc., far surpasses any other nation. And we continue to do it, even when we the hand are bitten by those we feed. Because that is what America is as a country. That is why I love this country, what she stands for, and while I am proud of every bit of my ancestry, I am also very proud to be an American.
Re: Your post
You wrote:
That is what America does. We point at what we believe to be wrong and say so. At least we used to.
I beg to differ somewhat on your view of our historical treatment of the Native Americans, being an amateur historian of the settlement of the West. The Native Americans alternately were glorified or vilified by the white culture. Had they not been portrayed as subhumans by our government at one time in the history of the West they would not have been exterminated so carelessly at times. As well, our history of race relations with blacks in the south is certainly nothing to be proud of. Perhaps another country should have come along in both instances and pointed at us, or we should have perhaps pointed at ourselves.
Your post
Yes, in some cases Native Americans were vilified by SOME in the white culture, not all. Yes, there were bad whites. Yes, they often attacked and killed when they should not have. Indians also attacked and killed when they should not have. The very first Americans, I am not talking about the West, but the colonists, got along with American colonists. And, as I stated, Indian peoples mistreated each other as well. There were wars, massacres, slavery, ill treatment. I do not say that to excuse anyone. I also do not think a the blame game for something that happened in the past is not productive. It does not enable people to learn from the past and move on. The persons involved in the villifying are long since dead. Yes, we need to learn from it, but we do not need to bear grudges. As I stated, I am of Indian descent, two different tribes. I bear no grudges. The people who did the deeds are long since dead and my bearing a grudge against men long dead serves no purpose. As to history of race relations with the blacks.... and if I might point out here members of my Cherokee ancestor's tribe, owned slaves. Slavery was not confined to the south. And, as a country, we DID point at ourselves. In case you do not recall, our country was divided and a civil war was fought. Many of my Cherokee ancestors fought for the Confederacy, the slaves they held right beside them. Members of the tribe of my ancestors were involved in the Trail of Tears, but they also held slaves. We need to leave the past in the past, learn from it, and move on steadfast in the idea that we will not allow it to happen again. That is the best thing we can do for those long since dead. Slavery was not the only issue in the civil war, but it was a major issue. So, I would say most definitely, we pointed at ourselves concerning slavery. No country would point at us because of slavery, because most other countries practiced it too. Slavery was not an American thing. Other countries had a class system, the haves and the have nots, and treated the lower cases horribly as well. This was not a problem that was originated in America. The difference is, it was not the entire country with us. We did not believe in that kind of behavior as a country, and we were willing to divide and fight a civil war because of that belief. As an aside, Africans enslaved each other. It was Africans who sold other Africans to white traders. As I said, there is blame to be had everywhere. Is there a country in the world with a history less repugnant to you than the US? Who has a history devoid of mistreatment?
No, want to see the post where I said....
....that I enjoyed finding errors and correcting people. This post says I enjoy doing research. I enjoy most research I do. I also worked in epidemiology in medical research for a good part of my 30s and 40s. Loved it. That's probably why I can be kind of exasperatingly exacting about people citing fiction as fact.
See my post above
It would certainly take an alternate reality to convice me of this.
THANK you for this post....if they want to
IF these posters want to continue to bury their heads in the sands, so be it.
and to FACT FINDER: You're gosh darn right - I'M scared of ALL of them - they all have an AGENDA...(members of the CFR/New World order/New American Century) -
How dare you be condescending and patroning to me or any poster and tell me to *run along* - I'm probably old enough to be your mother, or grandmother.
and remember, it's my generation that has the MOST number of voters today...those from 50-75 - we WILL make a big impact......
and no matter what I posted about Barack - I was not rude, patronizing, and condescending to any poster, as a few of you were.
We can all agree to disagree, now can't we? 
Just as an aside, I was evacuated on 9/11/01 from Newark Airport trying to get home (was in the financial district on 9/10/01) and it took me an extra week to get home....
so perhaps I'm more paranoid than most - and then you'll all have to forgive me because while we all changed that day, I never recouped from the incident nor will I ever. Yeah, it's my problem - but it's also EVERYBODY's problem.
And while I have Muslim friends - I also married French......and have watched France's Islamic population grow in leaps and bounds the past 30 years, coming close now to 30 percent of the country (60 million people in France, well over 25 percent are Muslim).......and I don't want that happening here. I want freedom for EVERYBODY - not people planning to take us down.....there are far too many extremist Muslims who want to do America harm (remember *Death To America* you hear chanted....remember so many of them dancing in the streets once 9/11 happened - Americans have short memories and forget far too quickly in my opinion).
I did read yesterday from some political blogger that down the road here in America, we should expect bombings in the street, car bombings - and when I spoke to my neighbors about this, they said *We are surprised it hasn't happened here yet* -
It's a very scary world today....so forgive me for my own paranoia - paranoia in this case being a heightened sense of reality.
Have a nice day!!
Your post...
Most of the information I found on S-CHIP was the expansion bill itself was on Congressional Library website, but there was no qualifying criteria listed because that is determined mostly by individual states. To find out what the qualifying criteria are, I think your best bet would be, since it is mostly state-administered, would be to go to the state websites to make a comparsion. Use New York state, like you suggest, go to their website and see if there is any information about qualifying. Then check the state site of midwestern, more rural state...like Oklahoma, Kansas, Iowa....if that doesn't work, just do internet search on *qualifying criteria for S-CHIP* and see what comes up. It could be that they don't publish that information on the net...don't know.
Now THIS is exactly why I used to like coming to this board. You see, I had just assumed that was written into the program, but it may very well NOT be, and if it is not, it SHOULD be.
I would still be against expanding it across the board, but I most definitely be FOR the income to qualify be driven by where the recipient lives.
Thanks!
Thanks, your post
must've been where I heard the New York thing. I didn't see an actual amount in the proposal either, so I think it will be up to the states to decide and I'm assuming the federal government will have the final say if a cap is too high. Funny how it's only the absolute maximum amount requested that gets reported as the 'norm'.
see post below
about Clinton being "blown to bits." Your response - Freudian slip? What are volunteering for? Retort to. Take it as you will through your personal filter.
I post
so others can chuckle at you.
Liked your post too
As I have said before, there has to be a happy medium between single-pay and what we have now. Everyone seems so scared to have the government control health care, but with what we have now, the insurance companies are controlling it!!!! Again, in my situation, I have a medical condition and have been denied private health insurance. Therefore, I have two options - I can work full-time, which is sometimes hard with the medical issues, or I can quit working altogether and get Medicaid. To me, that seems extreme. I know that there are thousands of people in my same situation and something needs to be done about it. Thank you for your post.
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