hold up...are you sure this is a Roman Catholic Church?...

• I am not Catholic and maybe this is how it is in all Catholic churches, but I have to ask! - SM -- I am steamed!
  • I am lapsed Catholic married to another lapsed Catholic.....sm - MT and worn out
  • Wow - Pugmom
  • I know the catholic religion has guidelines - sm
  • hold up...are you sure this is a Roman Catholic Church?... - i have a suggestion
  • From a cradle, practicing Catholic. - sm
    • Good golly, - MTIAM
  • does your future son-in-law sm - mb
  • I was married outside the - practicing catholic
  • Married long time ago in church. SM - Sally Forth
    • I apologize. I was generalizing and I don't mean to insult Catholics as a whole. - SM -- I am steamed!
      • Cradle Catholic, now Christmas Catholic here - AnnuderMT
        • I just want to jump in here and perhaps clarify. - Practicing Catholic
    • hmmm... I'm right along with ya.. - Gina
      • Never heard - raised catholic

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My daughter is engaged to a very nice young man who is Catholic or should I say his family is Catholic and he refuses to break ranks.  He has insisted they get married in his grandmother's (and his) church.  Okay, fine.  I'm fine with that.  My daughter is fine with that.  She started taking the conversion classes, but really isn't that interested in converting.  She was making the gesture for her fiance.  Fiance' says she doesn't have to convert and that she doesn't have to convert in order for them to be married in the church.

After they had been engaged for four months (they dated for a year before they got engaged), they called the priest at the grandmother's church to meet with him about setting a date and getting married.  First meeting, they drive into the city to meet the priest at the time he told them and the priest never shows up!  He later apologizes, but never offers an explanation for standing them up.  The second time they set up a meeting, the priest shows up.  He proceeds to tell them that before he can "allow" them to be married, he must first talk to family and friends to be sure they are not living together and also he has to give serious thought because my daughter is not Catholic and he has worries that the children they will not be raised in the church. He then proceeds to tell my daughter that she needs to wear a skirt or dress the next time she meets with him (she had on dress slacks and a blouse)!  He also wants to look at the wedding dress and the bride's maid dresses to be sure they are appropriate and that women should not show bare shoulders in the church, which basically means we have to have little covers/jackets made for each bride's made and now for the bride.

So my daughter tells me all of this and I'm irritated.  I decide that if this priest calls me, I'm going to give him what for.  In my mind, this is all a bit ridiculous.  Even if my daughter and fiance are living together (which they are) they are trying to rectify that by getting married.  My daughter begs me not to be rude and yet asks me to lie to the priest about them living together.  My daughter tells me that my son-in-law to be was raised to believe it is a sin to get married outside the Catholic church.  I wasn't aware that the Catholics still believed this.  But my daughter is adamant that she wants to do this one thing for her groom because the rest of the wedding is about her.  So okay, I stifle it.  I used to be young and in love and ready to do anything for my betrothed.

Next meeting with the priest, the priest is satisfied that they do not live together.  Thank goodness he never called me, so I was not forced to lie or be polite.  At the next meeting, however, he decides he's not going to give them an answer on whether or not they can be married unless my daughter memorizes the 10 commandments in order and also some sort of freaking prayer.  So my daughter calls me, clearly upset, but willing to do this one last thing.  I am outside my mind with outrage!  Still, it's my daughter's decision to participate in this dog and pony show.

Tonight, my daughter has a meeting with the priest, performs her little assignment, and presents her wedding dress for inspection.  The priest then says he's not going to marry them and wants them to wait a year, wants my daughter to officially convert, and then meet with him for pre-marriage counseling and start the whole show over again.

Now I'm furious and I am about ready to call this priest up and tell him what I think of him, his church, and all this crap he is espousing.  Who does he think he is?!?!?!?!  I am a Christian.  I attend an Assembly of God church and I do not believe for one minute that someone should perform tricks and jump through hoops just to get freaking married.  Yes, pre-marital counseling is probably a good thing, but other than that.

In my opinion, this priest is on some sort of power trip and is extremely self-righteous and pompous!  I also did my own investigating on this guy and found out that this same priest was asked to come to the hospital to give last rites to a dying Catholic woman whose own priest was out of town.  This priest said he would only come and administer the last rites if the daughter making the request would make a substantial donation to his parrish!  What kind of crap is that!!!?!?!!?

What kind of man is the priest?  Is this indicative of the entire religion of catholicism?  I hate to be rude, but they have priests molesting children and dabbling in homosexuality and yet this pompous ass of a priest treats my daughter as if she is not good enough to get married in his church!

Sorry this is so long, but I am just so mad!

I believe is hiding in another country for child molestation.  It has been Sharon's mother and sister who have been fighting to keep these people behind bars.  I don't know why the families of all the other victims are not speaking out.  It is mainly Tate's family of origin.  I just remember seeing a news clip of Sharon's mom being upset because they allowed Tex Watson, the leader of the crimes, conjugal visits and to conceive 4 children.  He would not allow Tate parenthood. 

I do wonder though, if they would not have went after the rich and famous, they probably would be out and shown mercy. 

that my religion, Methodist, don't have as I have relatives that have converted so they can get married.  I think in my cousin's case, he did not want to jump through all those hoops and was thinking about getting married by a methodist preacher.   That priest told them that if they do that, but then his wife-to-be would loose her place in the church, meaning she could still go but she could not, participate in ceremonies, make decisions for the church etc.,  because she would not be considered married and living in sin. 

Anyway, I think your dd and future SIL should get a 2nd opinion from another priest.  But, you should remember too that this is their battle.  If they are big enough to get married, they are big enough to fight their own battles.  If they truly want to be married than they will and this is pretty much small potatoes. 

Transgender Boy Barred From Catholic School
Parents Of 8-Year-Old Allow 'Him' To Live As 'Her'
Posted: 10:58 am EDT May 18, 2009
Updated: 11:50 am EDT May 18, 2009

OMAHA, Neb. -- An Omaha couple is allowing their 8-year-old son to openly live life as a girl. It’s a decision that means the child is no longer able to attend Catholic school.

Therapists and the child’s parents say the second grade student is transgender, a medical condition where a person’s inner sense of identity doesn’t match their biological gender. Some gender experts say as many as one in 500 people may be transgender or carry significant traits of the opposite sex.

"It’s kind of like you’re trapped somewhere and you can’t get out," said the boy, whose name and face are not being made public to protect the family from potential harm.

"She’s been a girl since the beginning, everything about her, the way she dances and skips around and the things she’s attracted to. It’s more than toys and clothes," said the child’s mother.

The mother said the child has consistently asked to be called a girl since she was 4 years old.

"One night, she said, 'Every night when I go to bed, I pray my inside will match my outside. But it never happens,'" the mother said, recalling the words of her middle child.

The child’s artwork is filled with crayon-colored images of princesses and mermaids. Her family has allowed the child to wear dresses and female clothing in their west Omaha home, but until recently, she had to change into boy clothes for her brother’s baseball games, church or any outing outside the house.

"Now I can wear nail polish, get rid of all my boy clothes and not worry about that name," the child said.

The child’s case recently came to light when her parents met with a leader of the Omaha Catholic Archdiocese to talk about transitioning the student into third grade at her school, St. Wenceslaus.

The family wanted the child to use a new female name, be able to wear a girl’s uniform and be included in girl’s activities.

The mother, a life-long Catholic, thought making the transition in their parish would be the best place for their child to continue friendships, with a support system that included other parents and children.

"The child is welcomed to come, but it would not be acceptable to change the child’s gender and present as a girl," said Omaha Archdiocese's Chancellor, the Rev. Joseph Taphorn.

Taphorn said having the child attend the school for three years as a boy, and then presenting as a girl would not be a good learning environment for the child or other students. He said school has to be a peaceful, positive environment for everyone.

The child will attend a public school in the fall, using her chosen name and wearing a ponytail in her hair.

"It was not a decision that was made rashly at all. It was a decision to protect her psyche and her self-esteem," the mother said.

Therapists agree that forcing a person to live in a social role outside their perceived gender is damaging.

Omaha mental health therapist Ellie Hites said she’s worked with more than 200 transgendered clients in Omaha over the past 35 years.
Hites said she does psychological evaluations on all of her clients.
"One hundred percent of the time, I’ve never had anybody show up anything other than healthiest in the chosen gender role, as opposed to biological," Hites said.

She said her adult transgender clients have lived through nervous breakdowns, suicide attempts and deep depression because they could never truly be themselves. She has four transgendered clients right now.
"The story that I get is that 'I've known since I was real little, but everybody laughed or nobody paid any attention,'" Hites said.

The therapist said transgendered children insist they are the opposite sex, consistently.

"It’s like they arrive here with one biology but the mental set is counter to that," Hites said.

The 8-year-old’s favorite color is aqua. Her favorite toy: American Girl Dolls. And right now she’s reading a Junie B. Jones book that made her giggle when she talked about the plot.

Pink and aqua barrettes held her shoulder-length layered hair out of her face, while she drew chalk pictures of clouds on the pavement.

When her mother announced that the child would be allowed to pierce her ears next week, the girl screeched and had a huge smile on her face.
"You’ve waited long enough to live as a girl," the mother said.

The mother is on a mission to educate the community and encourage churches to open a dialog about diversity and acceptance of all people.
She recently waged an e-mail campaign to urge her church members to place an empty envelope in the collection basket on Mother’s Day weekend. She said she wanted to send a message to the church that church members can have a voice and that they shouldn’t just blindly follow the flock.

"Just take the time to listen. It is different. It’s something most people have never heard of, but it doesn’t make it scary or pathological," she said.