Bringing my issue with grandparents and cousins to the top
Posted By: Heartbroken on 2007-07-08
In Reply to:
I am sorry, I got myself out of town for the weekend to get away. I am still at a loss. I have tried contacting my grandparents numerous times to no avail. I emailed my sister, and she talked to my grandmother who said she has simply "missed my calls." Thank you all for letting me vent Friday and giving me opinions. I will not stoop to their level. Also, to the poster who asked why I think the baby's name had to do with it, it is because she kept saying, "Figure it out, Daddy's girl" and because when I asked if that was it, she said, "What baby, did I say something about a baby" and "aren't you a little Einstein."
Thanks again all!
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I have cousins that grew up there
The lakes down there are beautiful going from Chatta into Guntersville. I probably did not appreciate it much as a child but a few years ago took my father on trip there and was blown away by the scenery.
Have guy cousins in early 20s and my nephew
is 17. They shop a lot at Macy's. We're in the NY area. Apparently certain brand names are "in" like Ecko, Sean John, Polo, etc. but can be very expensive. As far as hairstyles, maybe check out the hairdos on some of the clothing/store websites. Here's one from Macy's. If I lived near you; I'd help with the makeover :) Sounds like fun. lol
http://www1.macys.com/catalog/index.ognc?CategoryID=11345&PageID=11345*1*24*-1*-1&kw=Sean%20John&LinkType=EverGreen
I agree - this sounds like our cousins son
I don't know what your going through but I just wanted to tell you this sounded like our cousins son. Come to find out he was way more intelligent and had a lot of pent up energy. They took him to testing and found he was 2 years ahead of his classmates, so they enrolled him in 7th grade instead of 5th the next year, and they also got him involved in sports and he's so much happier and doing really well. I wish you all the best while you're working this out.
Yea, my cousins live there.....the kids are
nm
My daughter is distant cousins of Steve Martin & is also related to
right Steve Martin is related to George Washington's wife. What a country we live in!!!
grandparents
I'm curious about how involved grandparents are in your child/children's lives........ how often they visit with them; overnight stays; extracurricular activities; babysitting, etc.
If you are a grandparent, how involved are you?
grandparents
My parents were very involved with my daughter when she was growing up - she stayed with them an average of 2-3 nights/per month. . She loved everything about them and everything they did. .they didn't spend a lot of money on her but always gave her tons of time. . as she got older, they would go to her school activities, etc. . After she could drive and after my dad died, she would take my mom places - shopping, out to eat, etc. . Mom died last May and it was hard for all of us. . My ex-husband's dad died before our daughter was born and his mother has never been much of a grandparent. . she lives in another state but still makes little attempt to be a grandmother - when my ex died (daughter's dad) her grandmother asked her what she could do to be a better grandmother. . she was told just call sometimes, send a birthday card, Christmas card, etc. . but she still made little attempt to stay in touch. . My daughter (who is almost 23 now and on her own) called me the other day because she was so excited she had received a letter from her grandmother. . In my opinion, grandparents can contribute so much. . I can't wait to be one!
Grandparents
My children are extremely close with their grandparents on both sides. My DH father passed away when my son was 6 months old and it breaks my heart that none of his grandchildren ever got to know what an incredible man he was. Both my children as well as my 3 nieces are extremely close with DH mother. She has always attended their school/sport events. When they were younger (there are 5 grandchilden in all) she would take one child out every Friday night and let them pick where they ate and what they wanted to do. They then spent the night with her. Last Sunday after church my son spent the afternoon with Granny just running errands.
My children are also very close to my parents. I lost my mother 3 years ago but they spent a lot of time with her and she was always at their activities, usually with DH mother. My father and stepmother don't seem to make it to very many of the kids events due to their schedule, but they are very mucha part of their lives. They are a lot better at being grandparents then they were parents. LOL!
What you say about how grandparents should do
My grandchildren are up some size and they could come see me. Do they? No. I did my part in keeping my children close to their grandparents as youngsters but my DIL so wound up in her own family, the paternal side just does not matter. I don't even try anymore.
I'm from KY and my dad and all 4 grandparents used
to eat scrambled pig brains every once in a while for breakfast. They slaughtered their own hogs, so they were available occasionally. That is one thing I never tired. We ate squirrel growing up too. And to this day still love fried country ham and red-eye gravy with homemade biscuits.
THANK YOU for bringing that to my attention
I totally agree, and I signed the petition. I wish they would pass a similar bill about childbirth. Some women can only stay in the hospital 24 hours after their child is born (or it may be 24 hours total, I'm not sure). Or at least that's all their insurance will pay for, if it is a healthy birth with no complications.
I am currently fighting with my HMO about a medication that I desperately need. At the moment I am buying it through a "Canadian pharmacy" (based in New York state) and it is sent to me from Mumbai, India. In the U.S., the medication costs $10.00 a pill!!! Through this pharmacy, I get it for $1.77 a pill. But it is still more than twice what my normal co-pay would be if the $#@%#$ HMO would cover it.
So any kind of insurance reform bills that ANYONE knows about, PLEASE pass the info along. Thanks!
how about bringing someone into your home
a few hours maybe 3 days a week? You could canvass local daycares and find someone who has toys and resources to come in and work with your son. They can encourage good behavior with a reward system (have you tried a reward system instead of a punishment system?) It really sounds as though your son is understimulated in addition to wanting to run things and needing the right kind of attention (I don't say this to offend you...but you may not be meeting his needs with being so overwhelmed and things have just gotten into a rut). I had to work every Saturday for 2 months recently and I got a daycare worker my daughter loves to come spend a few hours of one-on-one time. I got my work done, my daughter felt special, the cost was minimal compared to what I earned, and the sitter loved coming. It was a win-win situation.
It is unrealistic to think you can strip your house of everything you need and want to live with. If what you are doing now is not working, you need to do something different. I hope you get some creative ideas.
How far away from your grandparents do you live?
It sounds like it would be better for you to talk directly to your grandparents if possible, instead of your aunt or cousins. Just leave them out of the loop if they are going to act this way.
You have a right to name your child whatever you choose. I don't understand why these people are getting so upset. But sometimes people - especially family - will use the least little excuse to create drama. You don't need that in your life, especially not with a new baby to take care of.
If your grandparents live far away, do they have any neighbors are friends that they are close to who could help keep an eye on them for you? My mother had a couple of neighbors who all looked out for her and each other - if one was gone one of the others would watch the house and take in the mail, or if they hadn't seen one of them in a while, they would go check on them, things like that. If your grandparents have neighbors they are close to, you might do better calling them instead of your family. Sad but true.
Good luck. I hope you are able to see and talk to your grandparents. Don't let these other folks get you down. They'll get over it eventually.
Grandparents are not involved much. . sm
It's funny you should ask this question today. My mom, who lives 90 minutes away, came for a visit. We haven't seen her in about 4 months. My 2-year-old didn't know who the heck she was and was scared of her for the first day she was here. We only see her 3 to 4 times a year. I wish we could see her more. My dad died when my oldest was one. He had never even met him.
My husband's parents have little to do with the kids. They live 20 minutes away, and we hardly see them. It really hurts because they always have my SIL's kids. They are the same age as my kids and spend almost every weekend at their house. During the summer, they spend even more time with them. After a couple of years of this, I finally asked them why they don't ever have my kids over. They said they will try to spend more time with them. Last summer, they invited the oldest to spend one night, and the SIL's kids were there. I am giving up. Sorry this got so long. I am really sad about this right now.
Bringing up the thread on NY bagels
before it gets * pruned *
I have a dumb question - - - - what makes a NY bagel so great??? I would think it is just bread dough formed in a circle....like I get at Albertson's or Safeway or Ralph's.
Bringing your kids to see their granddad sm
My perspective: I had an uncle who was severely ill several years ago. His sons lived in different parts of the country and when he was well enough, they flew him in to visit. I could not see him so often, so I decided to write little notes to him from time to time. Talked about some funny things that he had done and how much they made me laugh. When he was gone, my aunt told me how much those trips and the notes meant to him, it was like a gift that he and the family got to experience before he was gone, a chance to say good-bye, that many people don't get.
My prayers are with you and your family.
Depends on who's bringing the desserts.
In my family some of us are cooks and some aren't. So it depends on who brings what. If it's easier for the person to buy a pie than make it, that's fine. If I'm bringing dessert, I usually make the pies. I have a sister who does not cook, so she always buys them. BUT she buys really good ones from local pie shop. For the first time, this year my 12 yo niece has been put in charge of dessert for Thanksgiving, with my SIL overseeing it. She's learning to cook and bake and even called me to ask for one of my dessert recipes that she really likes. I'm very pleased she's trying and don't really care what she makes, it's the thought.
P.S. I do have a pumpkin pie stashed here at the house for later tomorrow night though! 
Bringing back memories. NM
x
Rules about bringing medication to
school are there for a reason. She knew she was not supposed to do it as all of that is explained EVERY school year. In our schools, medications (even aspirin) is kept in the office with a note from a doctor (whether rx or not) and they dispense it.
What doctor does my DH need to see: Bringing up post
from below. I was unable to answer until today.
Those are good suggestions, but it can't be CO2 as it happens when he's standing in his garage too. He doesn't get a headache, just the eye problem. He had his INR check/doctor appointment yesterday and told him about it again.
Finally, an answer....sort of! Can't be low blood pressure because of the Toprol. Can't be blood too thick because he's on Coumadin. If DH wants, doc will make an appointment for the specialist (supposedly one of the best in the country) for a look-see and maybe some sort of laser treatment. It has to do with fluid build-up behind the eye that puts pressure on the nerves or something like that. It's harmless, so he says.
I don't like it and wish he would get it checked out, but we're still waiting for his first check of the year. So, he's going to hold off.
He's also supposed to be bringing his young little
girlfriend on the show... This is on film forever and ever for the kids to get to re-live their father leaving the family for a new hot young thing. How lovely for the kids.
And to those who say, 'but Kate is a hard-@$$...' he knew how she was before he married her, and he certainly knew how she was before the last batch of kids. He made that bed & now he's abandoning it for a newer younger bed. What a great guy....
Are your grandparents your father's parents?
If so, maybe they are angry that you named baby after step-dad instead of their son. They expect you to be loyal to your Dad but not your stepdad who I would assume was in your life as much as your real Dad if not more. Families can be such selfish hypocrites. Where is their loyalty to you and their gratefulness to a man who probably helped raise you. I would cut them off in a New York minute. If you have children and a sister, you have family. Take care.
Is giving grandparents a scrapbook
I think it would be, but decided to get opinions. Thank you in advance.
No kids here, but I grew up w/grandparents.
They actually lived in our childhood home with us. Our mother was a single parent trying to get off welfare back in the 60s...going to night school to become an LPN and rearin' the 5 of us during the day. I have no doubt her parents saved her tuckas by doing all they did for her (and us!) back then. I have nothing but incredibly fond memories and miss them all immensely.
There's something to be said for families that pull together like that when times are tough, or even not so tough. Some days I regret not having one of my own, but I'm just waaaay too selfish and I know I'd make a horrible parent. Plus, I have no social support at all and I would be 100% on my own...certainly not the ideal way to raise a kid or two.
Fantastic assets grandparents can be...so long as they're not criminals or anything.
Grandparents are Heaven on Earth
I have no kids so can only give you a viewpoint of how my grandparents shaped my life. I grew up very close (personally) to my grandparents (grandma was my second mom). My grandparents (moms side) lived up the road from us (about a 5 min walk with an open field between us). In the mornings we would walk outside and if she was out we would yell "hello up there" and grandma would yell back "hello down there". She took care of my sister and I during the day while mom worked. We went everywhere with her every day (hairdresser, butcher, stores, errands, church activities, her friends house, etc). She taught us how to whistle with a blade of grass, play "here is the church & here is the steeple, open the doors and see all the people" with our hands. We ate every Sunday supper with them and then she and grandpa moved the living room furniture and taught us how to polka to Lawrence Welk. We also ate there often during the week. Once a week we would spend the night at their house. Grandpa had a lawnmower repair and sales business but anytime I was having trouble in school, he would come in and after supper sit down and help me (mostly with math), but he didn't even think twice about not helping. He was the most unselfish person in the whole world. When I was feeling down about my grade on a report card or test (I was a C & D student, occasionally a B and very rare an A) he would ask me if I did the best that I could and I said I tried really hard but I just didn't understand. He told me as long as I tried the hardest I could he was proud of me. We grew up in the country and g'ma taught us about wild flowers, quilting, and other country type stuff. During the winter we would have sled parties at her house for my girl scout troop and she would bring out hot cocoa with mini marshmallows. Just a couple years ago my best childhood friend was telling me she had just been thinking about that sled party and my grandma bringing us the hot cocoa, and I just have so many wonderful life memories the list would go on and on. She died when I was 16 (30 years ago), grandpa died a few years ago. I miss them so much it still hurts. My dad's grandparents lived 15 minutes from us and we spent every Sunday afternoon with them and when I was old enough to drive I would go up on my own during the weekdays and sit at the table and talk and talk with grandma for hours. I miss them both so much too. I think grandparents are the most wonderful gift a child could have. I was blessed to have mine live so close to us. They spoiled us rotten and we loved it!
Oh how I dream of being young again and having my grandparents to talk to. I'm now 48 and live alone with husband. All my grandparents and mom are gone, dad lives across the country and I see him once every 3 years. I sure do miss them all. I hope all kids have a chance to be close to their grandparents the way I was.
My mom (when she was alive) and dad all have fond memories of their parents (they both told me they had the best parents anywhere).
So the only way I can sum it up is that "Grandparents are Heaven on Earth".
kids visiting grandparents over the
you choose to not work nights so you could have time for you? LOL.... does anyone else see the craziness in this?
Giving up and bringing him to your bed was your biggest mistake -
You are teaching him that you are going to give in to him if he whines a bit. If you will just consistently hold out and not go to him, he will stop it in a few days. I just went through this with my new pekingese. She took about 2 weeks of crate training before she quit whining. I never gave in to her for whatever reason and even if it was time to take her out, I never got her out until she was completely quiet. Now, all I do is tap the box when it is time to go in and she usually goes in completely on her own and she never cries anymore.
I might add that grandparents on paternal side are deceased so
only ones around are mine but that doesn't seem to matter to them.
My grandparents swore by it for LOTS of things
xx
In Europe, bringing pets into stores is quite common and has been
g
Go for the classics, like Bringing up Baby or Philadelphia Story.
How about Blazing Saddles, Life of Brian, A Fish Called Wanda, or My Cousin Vinny?
She is a 68-year-old ROCK STAR, still bringing down the house. 'Nuff said. nm
x
Maybe learn some life planning skills before bringing blessings into the world that you can't aff
and not very responsible or mature.
Bringing Lost discussion up to top of board (major spoiler alert)
Okay, all you "Lost" fanatics, what are your theories now, and how have they changed? Who or what is Jacob? How did the "original inhabitants" of the island get there? They are mostly Caucasians with American accents, with a few exceptions. They don't look like the usual types of people who are native inhabitants of Polynesian islands - if, indeed, that is where the island is.
Why were Jack and Juliet keeping secrets from the rest of the group? If they had been honest and up front from the beginning about Juliet, maybe they could have all figured out a way to foil Ben's plans without bloodshed.
And will the island heal Locke? Obviously he is of major importance - I don't think Ben heard Jacob at all, and he was jealous and afraid when he realized Locke heard him. That's why he shot him. Ben is turning out to be an even bigger weasel than before.
And what exactly was the Dharma Initiative studying? Does Ben really know? After all, he was only a "work man" like his father.
For every answer, there are a dozen new questions - at least! 
I used to give my grandparents gift certificates to the local grocery store, sm
they would use them to buy special things like shrimp or other things that might cost a bit more that they wouldn't normaly buy for themselves. My parents are that age and I have given them restaurant gift certificates or if they have family out of town, prepaid phone cards, because I know some folks that age don't like paying for long distance calls.
What is sadder is the grandparents live in a small home, 3 bedroom, and filed bankruptcy 2 years ago
nm
I don't see what one issue has to do with the other.
I don't like the fact that he won, but he's a free to gamble, as are we all.
Probably because it's really a non-issue.
(She was great on SNL a couple weeks, ago, too! Her 'double-takes' etc. were cracking me up.)
My dog and my issue sm
I must have a lot of this chemical or something.
If I am unwittingly *glutened* I get the toots and they are...highly unpleasant, shall we say. Now, I understand that dogs generally enjoy this, but my poor dog does not. She hears the noise, whines and RUNS as fast as she can to other room. Not too long ago, she was being a terrible pest and I needed to get up to work. I made the sound with my mouth. She tucked her ears and tail, and made B-line for the bedroom away from where she thought was coming!
This chemical might be good for my blood pressure, but not so good for my dog.
I had that issue too for a while - sm
I "adopted" my dad's husky and he was used to being totally spoiled. I give both him and my lab dry. He was finicky for about 3 days but after seeing the lab finish up his food for 3 days he started eating no problem. He has started to get a bit picky again so we make up beef boullion for him and add some to the food and he is back to eating w/o a problem. Think he just got bored and wanted some more flavor. Boullion is cheap and easy to make.
I have had this issue for a while myself- sm
My DH will not do a vasectomy though I explained it is easier for him than I, etc. I would have possible heavier and painful periods, which I don't want. Right now they are heavy but I forget most of the time I even have it, which is bad as I have "accidents" then. But I have never really been affected from my period, no cramps or bloating, I do get headaches but that is about it. I have been leaning towards that IUD now, Mirena I think it is called. Figure I will hit menopause in 10 years so can wait it out in the meantime. He knows I am using nothing so if I get pregnant at 43 it will be a whoops, and we are having another child late in life. He would not like it but tough noogies.
Thanks but here is the issue
Living in a smaller town, although right next to a huge complex, not many here that I can locate anyway does acupuncture. The nearest one I found before was probably about 30 or 40 miles away. I can self refer as I have PPO insurance so a referral not needed for me. I just want to know how to word an I only want to use #1 as a pain clinic physician.
Well, sometimes there is a medical issue
as there is here, not just eating and eating for no reason at all. Was always trim and slim until this but thanks anyway for the curt note.
Wiretapping is a whole different issue
You have an expectation of privacy when you have a phone conversation (although cell phones have pretty much burst that bubble). The government shouldn't be able to listen in unless there is cause for them to be suspicious that you are involved in criminal activity.
The other information - SS#, birth certificate, marriage certificate - is already on file with the government. You aren't telling them anything they don't already know.
There is also the behavior issue of (sm)
submissive piddling.
You can buy something called a Belly Band for him to wear in the house. If he dribbles with it on, he gets himself wet, so this can teach him not to let that happen. I've just heard that not all pet stores call it a Belly Band or know what that is, but you can Google something like house training, canine belly band, and you can read about it and maybe order on line.
Corgis are so cute. You can post pictures here on the gab board.
I think it is more of an issue of not supporting
things/people that I find morally wrong.
Granted, the God hating was not translated from the book to the movie, but that is not the point.
The point is, that this author had the audacity to write in his books about wanting children to kill God and that is wrong to ME.
I have every right to boycott this movie for that very reason because I am not giving this man a dime of my money and support.
It's not just about whether the movie is going to wrongly influence my children, it's about standing up for what you believe from the beginning.
I'm going through a similar issue.
I've had pain in my left upper, right upper and right lower quadrant for years now. I keep going to the doctor, he keeps trying to tell me I'm constipated. I'm not. I would know if I wasn't regular. I had a hiatal hernia when he thought my upper mid abdominal pain was reflux, and I had kidney stones when he thought my previous upper left quadrant pain was constipation. Now he tells me I'm a hypochondriac because I do medical transcription. However, they found fibroids and some other abnormality on ultrasound. Still haven't gotten those results back because they want me to pay another $150 office visit just to tell me what my $800 ultrasound said. Everyone else is telling me to have a HIDA scan to see if I have gallbladder disease for the right upper quadrant. I don't know if the left upper quadrant pain is another kidney stone or renal colic. I didn't know if fibroids hurt and would cause the right lower quadrant pain. Yes, I do worry that it's cancer. So I must be just a hypochondriac. I guess what I'm saying is, your daughter knows her body better than anybody else. If she thinks something isn't "right," she needs to pursue it. I don't think it's normal to be in pain every day.
Is it a necessary medical issue or just something
x
If you would like to further educate yourself on this issue
INTERESTING ARTICLE
I realize this is very long, but as an expert in this field, I want to re-post information I sent, in September, to another blogger concerned about the "Best Friends" summit.
I want to emphasize that the following information is based on years of dedicated research, and decades of dog training experience. I do not simply pass along information I've heard or read somewhere...which is sadly what most people, on all sides of dog-related issues, do.
I recognize that some of your readers may find parts of it quite controversial. That's okay. Facts are facts, even if they conflict with some other [expert's] unresearched opinions.
As such, I've opted to leave those sections in, because they're vital in refuting unfounded notions about dogs, canine genetics, and dog behaviour, which lead to myths about canine aggression.
Any individual point of controversy should not take away from the overall message of fact and reason that does not support the view that any entire dog breed could be considered "dangerous".
Only once people stop repeating inaccurate information (no matter how good it may sound), will we ever hope to get to the heart of this issue, and start reducing the number of unprovoked dog bites.
The following was written "off the top of my head", in response to concerns about the Best Friends' agenda. It is not a composed article meant for publication. Please also keep in mind, it has a decidedly Canadian perspective, although there is ample U.S. data referenced.
This is what I wrote (with a few minor clarifications):
Dear (blogger),
As you know, I am an expert in Canadian dog bite statistics.
After years of research, there are a number of interesting facts I've uncovered (most of which are now widely published). As such, I've provided a synopsis here, for you and your readers. I realize it is very long, but it is a more concise collection of my years of research; right here, in one place.
The situation with unprovoked dog bites is not what nearly everyone believes it to be.
If I had one pet peeve, it is that most people merely repeat things they’ve heard or read. They don’t really know if what they’re saying is true or not. They merely “believe” those things to be true, and that’s enough for them, I guess.
You know what I say, “No matter how often or loudly a myth is repeated, it is still just a myth.”
Some people simply like agreeing with others. Some like to pretend they’re especially knowledgeable or have unique insight. Whatever the source for so many of these myths, years of research has proven the majority of beliefs I encounter about dogs are simply untrue.
Whenever discussing the issue of dangerous dogs, it's always important to remember a few key points about the dog bite statistics (especially as they pertain to Canada):
1. The most dangerous breeds in Canada are, in order: German Shepherd, Cocker Spaniel, Rottweiler, and Golden Retriever.
Why do I say this? Well, this is not dog "bite" data, but rather dog "attack" data based on the reporting information from the Canadian Hospital Injury Reporting and Prevention Program (CHIRPP).
The CHIRPP members (hospitals, and reporting physicians and nurses) have no reason to lie about the information they receive, surrounding the breed of dog that has attacked.
Why do I say "the most dangerous"? Well, because the CHIRPP data only applies to the most severe dog attacks (i.e. those injuries serious enough to require treatment in hospital). These are not little nips that can be treated with ice or even a band aid. These are severe dog bite injuries that need to be treated in hospital. The dogs that cause the most serious injuries in Canada belong to the above-mentioned breeds, more than any others.
Unlike municipal dog bite data (where any bite, no matter how inconsequential, or even against other animals, is counted), the CHIRPP data only relates to the most serious dog attacks against human victims.
2. 'Pit bulls' are rarely in the #1 spot in dog bite statistics.
Any measures to restrict or ban the #2, #5, or #37 'breed' of dog in the dog bite statistics, but not #1, is pure hypocrisy.
As faulty as the logic may be, if you're going to ban or restrict a type of dog in an attempt to reduce the number of dog bites, then it must be the ones who bite the most and/or cause the most serious injuries. Either way, that 'breed' is not 'pit bulls'.
3. There hasn't been one confirmed death of a child attributed to an unprovoked attack by a 'pit bull' in Canadian history. (There has been one unconfirmed death.)
4. The very first human fatality attributed to an unprovoked attack by a 'pit bull' in Canadian history occurred in May of 2006. Until then, every insinuation or claim about Canadians being in danger of being killed in unprovoked attacks by 'pit bulls' was totally unfounded.
(In the Ontario case in May, the dog was actually only part 'pit bull'. It was a Labrador Retriever/'pit bull' cross, and the dog's owner was the victim.) (It should be noted that there have been at least two human fatalities in Canada attributed to unprovoked attacks by Labrador Retriever crosses, yet this was the first for a 'pit bull' cross.)
5. Municipal dog bite statistics often combine reported dog bite data against both humans and other animals.
While I don’t have any problems with doing so, those citing combined statistics must be aware that the majority of the dog bite reports aren’t against people. To imply otherwise is, at best, misleading and, at worst, dishonest.
For example: Toronto has arguably the largest municipal ‘pit bull’ population in Canada. In 2004, 12 of the city’s estimated 30,000+ ‘pit bulls’ had been reported for biting. (That’s about 0.04% of the population, by the way; leaving 99.96% of Toronto’s ‘pit bulls’ completely innocent of such allegations.) However, the majority of those reported bites were against other animals. Only 2 of the 12 could even begin to be called “attacks” against humans.
So, when 2 out of at least 30,000 dogs of a loosely-defined type are involved in attacks in an entire year, is that really justification for not just trying to ban or restrict them, but for making sweeping generalizations about all the rest?
6. No matter what dog ‘breed’ tops the dog bite statistics, the vast majority of bites are still attributed to other breeds.
To better help people understand the absurdity of a breed-based approach to dog bite prevention, let’s imagine that ‘pit bulls’ are responsible for a virtually unheard of 10% of bites in some Canadian city. That still leaves 90% of biting dogs unaffected by any breed-based approach.
This is the primary reason why breed bans have been such a colossal failure wherever they’ve been tried. The majority of biting and attacking dogs are not affected, so their owners are free to continue to behave negligently.
7. All dogs can bite.
There is no such thing as a breed of dog that has never bitten, never attacked, never maimed, or never killed (a person or other animal).
8. It is the size of the victim, not the dog, which best predicts severity of injury in an attack.
While even the very smallest dog breeds have killed humans, the very largest dog breeds are rarely involved in attacks.
9. Adults are rarely seriously injured by dogs of any size, while children are the most common dog bite victims. Their attackers range from the very smallest to the very largest dog breeds.
10. The dogs actually involved in attacks are not genetically related in any meaningful way.
This goes right to the heart of common, yet completely unscientific, baseless claims about allegedly inheriting aggressive behaivours or being bred for aggression.
In short, the dogs involved in attacks are not closely genetically related to one another. This tends to refute the idea that the attack was due to some aberrant inherited gene.
Think about it. What could the Dalmatian that bit off a boy’s nose 10 years ago and the Golden Retriever that left 76 stitches in a girl’s face, just a few years ago, possibly have in common, from a genetic standpoint? Is anyone really trying to suggest they’re genetically related, and both inherited some sort of as-yet-undiscovered “attack gene”?
Even the Rottweiler that killed a child in New Brunswick and the Rottweiler that killed a child in Ontario don’t share any common ancestors in their pedigrees; making the whole notion of a shared genetic cause for attacks completely ludicrous.
Put simply, the individual dogs involved in unique attack incidents are not genetically related in any way other than that which makes them dogs.
11. Psychology defines aggression as learned behaviour.
I’ve been researching dog biting incidents since 1999. I have yet to find a dog involved in an attack that didn’t have a known history of aggressive behaviour.
Aggression has to be learned and practiced before it is perfected. I have yet to come across a case of a dog that attacked unprovoked, without ever having barked menacingly, growled, lunged, snapped, or what have you.
This completely refutes the (quite silly) urban myth that “some dogs just turn”, or that dogs can be THIS unpredictable. (i.e. friendly family pet with no history of ever having behaved aggressively one minute; then savage, unprovoked attacker the next)
As an experienced dog trainer (one who has spent many of those years SUCCESSFULLY re-training aggressive dogs), I can attest that dogs are not all that unpredictable. Sure, they might do something out of the ordinary, every now and then. However, for a dog to suddenly behave aggressively in a way that is truly threatening or injurious, it must have practiced those behaviours in the past. This is the nature of all learned behaviours. Only practice makes perfect. (I can elaborate more on that, if you wish.)
It’s as though people can’t imagine any other form of aggressive behaviour, other than biting. To help them along, I must point out that aggressive behaviours follow a fairly predictable scale of escalation. It may begin with staring or raised hackles (all merely indicating discomfort with a situation). That can lead to raised lips, growling, stiffened body posture, menacing barking, lunging, and attempted bites. Long before an unwarranted bite ever occurs, there are a litany of warning signs that the dog will eventually bite.
Even the most die-hard dog fighting breeders admit they have to start their puppies very young (often at six weeks), to turn them into superior fighters. When asked why they have to spend so much effort training their (allegedly bred-to-fight) dogs, none can provide a scientifically or practically sensible response. Most use made-up terminologies to emphasize what they believe are inherited traits, while playing down the daily training they force on the dogs. Yet it is clear that, without this ongoing encouragement, the dogs don’t become proficient fighters.
I’ve researched so many cases where the owner has allegedly claimed the attack was the first time the dog behaved aggressively, I now pay little heed to such statements. The neighbours almost always tell a very different story.
To use a more famous case as an example, little Courtney Trempe was killed by a dog the owner claimed had never behaved aggressively before. The owner went on to say he “couldn’t have known” the dog would attack, because it had never tried to bite a person. Well, it turns out the dog had not just attacked previously, but had actually killed two neighbourhood dogs in the past. That is an aggressive dog, by anyone’s standards.
But it does bring me to my next point…
12. Aggression is aggression is aggression. The idea that aggression can be species-specific is not based in any kind of scientific, statistical, or practical data. It seems to be little more than wishful thinking. Those perpetuating this notion tend not to have even attempted to validate this theory in any way.
There is a very disturbing myth being promulgated by a number of groups that should know better than to perpetuate unfounded myths. The idea that aggression towards other dogs is markedly different than aggression towards humans is scientifically and statistically baseless. (But I realize a lot of people learned this myth, and repeat it as though it is true.) I have to point out that the real-world data, in no uncertain terms, clearly refutes such theories.
Of the dogs involved in their first aggression incident towards a human, the vast majority had behaved aggressively towards other animals (usually other dogs) in the past.
Of the dogs involved in their first bites against humans, where the dog had no history of aggression towards humans, the majority had behaved aggressively towards other animals (usually other dogs) in the past.
Of the dogs whose first bite against a person resulted in that individual’s death, and where the dog had no history of aggressive behaviour towards humans, every one of the cases I’ve investigated involved dogs that had behaved aggressively towards other dogs in the past. (see the Trempe case example, above)
So, while some aggressive dogs may, for now, limit their aggressive behaviour to other animals, it in no way guarantees it will remain that way forever.
Most, if not all, the first-time human biters had only behaved aggressively towards other animals, in the past. Their owners, having believed the myth that aggression is species-specific in dogs, are always "surprised" when their dog-aggressive dogs bite someone.
Again, dog-aggression could remain contained, for a number of social and environmental reasons. Statistically, these dogs are equally as likely to bite a human, one day. Dogs with histories of aggressive behaviour (towards either humans or other animals) are almost exclusively involved in unprovoked biting incidents.
13. Nearly all unprovoked dog bites would not be prevented by dog control laws.
Since dog control laws typically only apply to the conduct of owners (and their dogs) when they’re on public property, it completely negates their ability to affect the circumstances that lead to the vast majority of unprovoked dog bites.
When it comes to total dog bite numbers, almost all take place on the owner’s property.
When it comes to reported dog bite numbers, the overwhelming majority take place on, or directly adjacent to, the owner’s property.
Supervised dogs in a public place account for less than 1% of all bites.
This makes public restraint laws especially ineptly-aimed and ineffective in reducing dog bites.
Most unprovoked biting incidents involve (typically an unsupervised) dog known to the victim. Whether or not the victim knows the dog, the bite usually takes place on the owner’s property (where the dog is either loose or tethered), or directly adjacent to the owner’s property (where the dog was either allowed to venture off the owner’s property, or “escaped”).
Very few unprovoked biting incidents involve a supervised dog. Simple supervision appears to be very effective in preventing dog bites.
When bites take place far from the owner’s property, the dogs involved were most likely loose, roaming, unsupervised dogs.
Simply put, public restraint laws don’t target the situations that actually lead to unprovoked dog bites.
14. Cities that address the real causes of unprovoked dog bites (i.e. lack of supervision & lack of socialization and training) are hugely successful in reducing the number of dog bites.
Calgary is the best example we have in Canada. They reduced dog bites by 70%, even during a period where the population doubled.
Calgary’s approach was to first enforce existing laws. They strictly enforce licensing, and boast a licensing rate of 90% (compared to most cites’ 10-20%). In this way, they have a better handle on the dog population in their community, which helps in making decisions and drawing conclusions.
They also have a zero tolerance policy for acts of aggression. (Something I’m personally totally in favour of. Dogs are not weapons, and anyone who unethically uses a dog for that purpose shouldn’t be allowed to own one.) Any report of aggressive behaviour of any kind results in a visit from animal control and a warning.
City officials are clear, in that they agree one of the biggest aspects of their success was the creation of ample off-leash areas for dogs to be exercised, socialized, and trained off-leash. With reportedly the largest number of off-leash parks in Canada, it’s no coincidence that Calgary also has the lowest dog bite rate of any major city in Canada.
Several years ago, I made this prediction, “When the studies are done, we’ll find the cities with the best access to off-leash parks are also the cities with the lowest percentage of dog bites.”
Calgary certainly suggests my prediction was correct.
Finally, Calgary increased the penalties for some transgressions. Combined with increased enforcement, the large percentage of licensed dogs, along with the higher fines, has led to Calgary’s animal control department becoming financially self-sufficient.
It’s win, win, win, in Calgary, all because they addressed the real causes for unwarranted aggression in dogs.
15. Breed-specific approaches to dog bite prevention have failed.
There isn’t one region that can claim a reduction in the number, or severity, of dog bites as a direct result of banning a breed of dog.
In Winnipeg, officials promoting the city’s long-time ban on ‘pit bulls’ often misleads the public by stating “’pit bull’ attacks” have been eliminated. Well of course they’ve been eliminated. ‘Pit bulls’ are banned in Winnipeg. You don’t have to be rocket scientist to figure that out. There are also no wooly mammoth attacks or saber toothed tiger attacks, either.
When Winnipeg banned ‘pit bulls’, German Shepherds, and their crosses, were far and away the most common biters in that city. After ‘pit bulls’ were banned, there was an average of close to 50 more bites per year, for the following decade. In addition to the rise in overall dog bites, the number of bites by German Shepherds and crosses, Labrador Retrievers and crosses, Terriers crosses, and Rottweilers and crosses, skyrocketed.
Kitchener is another example. The city of Kitchener banned ‘pit bulls’ in 1997, without ever having done an analysis on the city’s dog bite data. Only after ‘pit bulls’ were banned was it discovered they were #8 in the 1996 dog bite statistics, “right behind #7 Poodles,” as it is commonly said. In what could only be a deliberate attempt to mislead the public, officials immediately halted the collection of dog bite data by breed.
Even so, while we don’t know which breeds have been doing the biting, we can still determine if the ‘pit bull’ ban has been effective in reducing dog bites in Kitchener. Every animal bite is required, by law, to be reported to the Medical Officer of Health. With a sleuthing, it was discovered that dog bites haven’t been reduced at all, since ‘pit bulls’ were banned in 1997. They’ve remained pretty constant.
According to a BBC report, hospitalizations due to dog bites rose 25% after ‘pit bulls’ were banned in England.
Officials from most of the cities that have repealed breed-specific laws have used terms like “ineffective” and “unenforceable”.
16. All dog breeds are genetically identical. Even DNA can’t distinguish between a Chihuahua, a ‘pit bull’, a Great Dane, and a wolf. (Yes, while there are occasional claims of in-roads, in this area, using "markers", all dogs are still considered genetically identical.)
Those rare individuals with the personal expertise necessary to accurately attempt to determine a dog’s breed based on appearance alone typically are not employed in the various occupations charged with enforcing most breed-specific legislation. This leaves the subjective determination of a dog’s breed to the very inexpert animal control and shelter workers. In some cases, police officers must decide the dog’s breed, yet not one police officer is trained to (accurately) differentiate between dog breeds.
The same can be said of veterinarians. A veterinary license infers expertise in diagnosing and treating illness, for the most part. Neither practicing veterinarians nor veterinary students are required to prove any expertise in breed identification in order to obtain a license. Any expertise an individual veterinarian may possess, in terms of breed identification, or even dog training and behaviour, was most likely acquired outside the requirements of licensing.
Because the people enforcing breed-specific laws are not dog breed identification experts, the likelihood of misidentification is unconscionably great. (In Ontario, several dogs have already been misidentified, under breed-specific ordinances.)
17. "The public" is not in danger of unprovoked dog bites.
For instance, every recent dog-related fatality in Canada has involved dogs and victims residing within the same home. The same could be said for the majority of bites and attacks, as well.
This is very important information, in terms of quelling the public’s hysteria. “The public” is rarely involved in unprovoked biting incidents. Most bite victims knew the dog and were voluntarily interacting with it at the time of the bite. Most bite victims are bitten by their own dogs.
If you don’t own a dog, your risk of being bitten is very low. If you also don’t interact with dogs, or live next door to a dog that is routinely left unsupervised, or one that is known to behave aggressively, then your risk of being bitten is virtually nil.
Even when we don’t account for contributing factors (such as proximity) you are still more than 100 times more likely to be hit by lightning than killed by a dog. (In Canada, the likelihood of being killed by a dog you don’t know or live with is virtually zero.)
18. ‘Pit bulls’ are, if anything, less likely to bite.
In the U.S., ‘pit bulls’ are estimated to make up 9% of the dog population, yet they typically only make up 2-4% of dog bites, nationwide. In case your readers don’t understand what that means, it would be expected, purely on population alone, that 9% of dog bites would be attributed to ‘pit bulls’. Since less than half (even a third) of bites are reportedly caused by ‘pit bulls’, this suggests they’re much less likely to bite than should be expected.
19. ‘Pit bulls’ are less likely to kill than people.
In the U.S., even extremely conservative estimates suggest that only 0.00002% of the ‘pit bull’ population has killed. This is much lower than the human population (men, in particular).
Whatever someone’s views about ‘pit bulls’ might be, it can’t change the fact that at least 99.99998% have never, and will never, kill anyone.
20. 99.9% of all dogs, from all breeds, will never be involved in an attack.
Huge generalizations about dog breeds is not only unscientific, it’s not even practically accurate. I like to put it this way, “If any ‘breed’ were genetically programmed to attack, certainly more than 0.1% of them would.”
21. The media.
While I don’t want to get into a protracted discussion about the lack of honesty in media reports of dog bites, I will summarize by saying that reviewing media reports of dog biting incidents is not “research” because the media is extremely biased in regards to which stories it chooses to cover.
The media reports dog biting incidents involving ‘pit bulls’ to the near-exclusion of all others. In addition, they use other tactics to exaggerate the details, such as salacious language, or references to other dog biting incidents involving ‘pit bulls’.
There are countless incidents of media bias. In Ontario, a ‘pit bull’ killed another dog, and it was front-page news, that reappeared in the media for weeks. The owner was swiftly taken to jail. Around the same time, two Labs killed another dog, and attacked a ‘pit bull’ without any real media interest. The owner of the Labs was not charged with any serious offence.
There are other blatant incidents, as well. One weekend, two off-leash dogs (one of them being a ‘pit bull’) got into a squabble, and every major media agency reported the incident. That same weekend, a child was mauled by the family’s Golden Retriever, and not one media outlet covered the story.
A child was mauled so savagely by his grandfather’s Labrador Retriever, he required treatment at two Ontario hospitals. Only one media outlet covered this story in just one broadcast.
Again, relying on the media for the facts of dog biting cases is not advised.
Naturally, I could go on. But there you have a pretty good primer (off the top of my head), regarding the facts about the who, what, where, when, how, and why dogs bite unprovoked.
Because I kept encountering the same story, over and over and over again, in my research of dog biting incidents, I was led to create a dog bite prevention strategy that deals with the factors common to nearly all the cases I’d investigated.
I made it simple, and easy to remember. And I made sure not to include anything that would require an individual to develop some kind of expertise. People who don’t own dogs or aren’t experienced dog trainers still have a right to protect themselves from unprovoked dog bites. The following is what I call, the “3 Simple Steps to Dog Bite Prevention”:
1. Avoid unsupervised dogs.
2. Never leave children unsupervised with dogs.
3. Ensure our own dogs are properly trained and adequately supervised at all times.
By following these “3 Simple Steps”, we could virtually eliminate unprovoked dog bites in Canada.
It is not just important, but vital, to know what ACTUALLY causes dogs to bite unprovoked, if we ever hope to reduce those numbers. Obtusely theorizing about possible causes or solutions is not helpful and, as in the case of breed-specific legislation, is often harmful to both humans and dogs.
If you would like more information, please don’t hesitate to contact me.
Sincerely,
Marjorie Darby
Founder,
how do you know if you have an eating issue sm
i have so many emotions running through my mind every single day, but not going to get into all of them here. i hope i don't have an eating issue/disorder, but sometimes i wonder. i grew up in a strict household (my dad was immature and always telling me i was fat and needed to lose weight). i'm an average size 5 foot 7 girl. i'm 36 now and constantly think about food, how many calories something has, fat content. i gain weight easily. i just get so tired of worrying about what i'm going to eat, cause it'll make me fat. sometimes i will sneak eating food, because my husband will say things like "do you really need that?" and he's just trying to help. but what i really think is i want is to join WW and have group support from other people that are going through the same thing. my husband can drink about six sodas a day, eat whatever and he doesn't gain weight. he doesn't exercise. it just makes me sad that i have to work so hard to not be huge. i'm about 165. i would like to get down to at least 150 or maybe less. my parents used to tell me when i was little not to waste food (we were poor so wasting food was like wasting money).
i'm sorry, i'm rambling on, but i really don't have anyone to talk to. sometimes i think i'd like to see a counselor. (i have never seen a counselor) i have other issues that bother me but won't get into it.
thanks for listening, just wondered if anyone else has food issues. i'm a healthy person. i don't smoke or drink. never did drugs. i try to eat healthy. i especially overdo it in stressful situations. yesterday i ate a little less than a pint of butter pecan ice cream. then i felt crappy the rest of the evening.
well i stop now.
marihuana issue sm
Not on ballot here, never tried it, wouldn't know where to get it. Once heard one is equal to 12 cigarettes. Sister died of lung ca., so afraid of it, although I never smoked. There are days though when my back hurts so much I might try it if I had it, so glad I don't have access to it! Can't judge others, just glad I never used it, too much stress in my life, may get to be a habit I certainly don't that!
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